unpaid D-I football

[HS Football Fanatic]

In order of strength,just as I see 2019, Campbell,Mililani,and Kahuku,should qualify for Open out of the OIA.

gopunahou, I know you bleed Buffanblu,but I feel that Punahou is in the second tier of Open contenders for 2019 along with the three OIA teams mentioned above. I feel that St.Louis is twice as good as any of Punahou, Campbell,Mililani,Kahuku. Kamehameha, Kapolei,Waianae,and Farrington are bringing up the rear again in the OIA-ILH Alliance.

However, ,I think St.Louis will be in a dogfight in 2020.The Crusaders lose too much to graduation in spring 2020.

How many consecutive years have you said “Crusaders lose to much to graduation”? last 2 years was no qb, I’m sure this year will be no DL. Remember ranking St Louis at #5? Or all the people saying “The Crusaders aren’t even the favorite to win the ILH, let alone repeat as state champs”. I mean they can’t win forever and if you keep saying the same stuff every year you will be correct sooner or later I guess

@genks: Well, St Louis School can't win forever, but they can win for a very long time. They were ILH and Prep Bowl / State champs for 13 straight years, '86-'99.

[HS Football Fanatic]

I think both Kam and Waianae had the same issue which was lack of a good qb. They both play tough defense and they both want to run the ball. But when teams pack the box and dare the qb to throw they struggle. I’m not sure if Walter (forgot his last name) Waianae’s former coach was just working with what he had or was he trying to ram his plays down the throats of the opponents. Maybe the new coach will have a bit more variety in the play calling

@genks: Well, a coach is supposed to formulate a strategy that matches his players, right? I agree, both Waianae and Kamehameha prefer the run game, and they've preferred it since the mid-'70s. There were a few years when Kamehameha had good QBs, but Waianae rarely had a good (pass) QB. But, the thing about Waianae and Kamehameha is that they've almost always had thick O-lines and good RBs, so no wonder they've preferred the run game.

[gopunahou]

I think both Kam and Waianae had the same issue which was lack of a good qb. They both play tough defense and they both want to run the ball. But when teams pack the box and dare the qb to throw they struggle. I’m not sure if Walter (forgot his last name) Waianae’s former coach was just working with what he had or was he trying to ram his plays down the throats of the opponents. Maybe the new coach will have a bit more variety in the play calling

@genks: Well, a coach is supposed to formulate a strategy that matches his players, right? I agree, both Waianae and Kamehameha prefer the run game, and they've preferred it since the mid-'70s. There were a few years when Kamehameha had good QBs, but Waianae rarely had a good (pass) QB. But, the thing about Waianae and Kamehameha is that they've almost always had thick O-lines and good RBs, so no wonder they've preferred the run game.

Couldn’t Sam Bailey of the late 80s do it all at Waianae? Anyway, your points about Waianae having a strong O-line and insistence on the running game are other reasons they are Hawaii’s version of Nebraska. I also think they’ve got supporters who are living in the past. None of Waianae’s current players were close to being alive when they last won the OIA championship.

[HS Football Fanatic]

I think both Kam and Waianae had the same issue which was lack of a good qb. They both play tough defense and they both want to run the ball. But when teams pack the box and dare the qb to throw they struggle. I’m not sure if Walter (forgot his last name) Waianae’s former coach was just working with what he had or was he trying to ram his plays down the throats of the opponents. Maybe the new coach will have a bit more variety in the play calling

@genks: Well, a coach is supposed to formulate a strategy that matches his players, right? I agree, both Waianae and Kamehameha prefer the run game, and they've preferred it since the mid-'70s. There were a few years when Kamehameha had good QBs, but Waianae rarely had a good (pass) QB. But, the thing about Waianae and Kamehameha is that they've almost always had thick O-lines and good RBs, so no wonder they've preferred the run game.

Couldn’t Sam Bailey of the late 80s do it all at Waianae? Anyway, your points about Waianae having a strong O-line and insistence on the running game are other reasons they are Hawaii’s version of Nebraska. I also think they’ve got supporters who are living in the past. None of Waianae’s current players were close to being alive when they last won the OIA championship.

@gopunahou: Well, I'm not sure that any school can win 13 straight league titles again. I mean, it's difficult to win, say, 4 in a row, let alone 13. And as for Waianae supporters living in the past, well, isn't that kind of what alumni naturally do? After all, alumni were at the school in the past. The school as it was in the past, is all they know. That's what they remember.

[unpaid]

Are we at the point of free agency in Hawaii hs football?

OIA-OIA transfers can happen,although the OIA is reviewing their rules,and might make them more restrictive,as in you have to sit out a year. Transfers between the OIA and ILH,no sit out years.

I bring this up because transfers have been increasingly getting more attention even down at the HS level in Hawaii and the other 49 as well. I think it's interesting for fall 2019 for a few reasons.

St. Francis has several standout fb players who have to finish their secondary school somewhere. What school do these players pick? It has been posted by another board member that rumor,take it for what it's worth, indicates that some ILH standouts might be transferring to OIA schools for 2019.

The ILH has always had the rep of recruiting public schools talent even back in my HS days in the late 60's. It seems to me that the pendulum swings both ways. At some point stockpiling the best talent fails you, because there are only so many starting positions up for grabs. When a lot of your second and third stringers realize they could be starting somewhere else and building recruiting interest from colleges,instead of waiting to maybe start their senior year and get D-II or D-III offer because they basically had a one year shot at proving what they could do,what would you do or have your kid do? Might have them go to a school where they can start and still compete for a title.

Is free agency here in Hs football?

[HS Football Fanatic]

Are we at the point of free agency in Hawaii hs football?

OIA-OIA transfers can happen,although the OIA is reviewing their rules,and might make them more restrictive,as in you have to sit out a year. Transfers between the OIA and ILH,no sit out years.

I bring this up because transfers have been increasingly getting more attention even down at the HS level in Hawaii and the other 49 as well. I think it's interesting for fall 2019 for a few reasons.

St. Francis has several standout fb players who have to finish their secondary school somewhere. What school do these players pick? It has been posted by another board member that rumor,take it for what it's worth, indicates that some ILH standouts might be transferring to OIA schools for 2019.;

The ILH has always had the rep of recruiting public schools talent even back in my HS days in the late 60's. It seems to me that the pendulum swings both ways. At some point stockpiling the best talent fails you, because there are only so many starting positions up for grabs. When a lot of your second and third stringers realize they could be starting somewhere else and building recruiting interest from colleges,instead of waiting to maybe start their senior year and get D-II or D-III offer because they basically had a one year shot at proving what they could do,what would you do or have your kid do? Might have them go to a school where they can start and still compete for a title.

Is free agency here in Hs football?

@unpaid: In effect, I think it is. Starting from the mid-'80s (possibly earlier), it was understood that St Louis School was ripping-off blue-chip players from McKinley High, by raiding MWH. (MWH is in McKinley High's district.) Starting about 7 years ago or so, Punahou School started ripping-off blue-chip players from Kahuku High. It's gotten to the point where some guys are calling Punahou School, "Kahuku South." (Should we start calling St Louis School, "McKinley East"?) Now you hear about blue-chip players shuttling between Mililani High and Campbell High and Kahuku High. Yeah; I think you could say that, in effect, we have free agency. It seems to be getting out of hand. Someone needs to put a stop to this outrageous situation; it's almost like a free-for-all. Too many people are thumbing their noses at school loyalty; too many people are being selfish and mercenary. High school football players here, need to stop pimping themselves to other schools. Parents need to get a grip, too. They're part of the problem.

[unpaid]

HS Football Fanatic,

Let me take it beyond transfers between Hawaii schools.

Sol-Jay Maiava got a Michigan offer by then and still current HC Jim Harbaugh when he was 13, not even in high school. Big news. He wound up as the starter in his freshman year and threw for around 800 yards. I remember posting back then that if Kahuku remained ground and pound oriented that that Michigan offer would never materialize in the end. If he stayed at Kahuku,he would never have passed for 2500+ yards a year and kept UM's interest. As we know now,he goes to a DC hs and has put up huge passing numbers and is getting in line for a Power 5 chance.

Parents ,rightly so realize education is key,and athletics are one way to ease the financial burden,so.....sometimes many families believe that ,if their kid has promise in the classroom and football field then they will send them to Bishop Gorman,Orem,Silverado etc on the Mainland to get their kids more exposure.

It makes shambles of the be true to your school concept I was raised with. That said,I don't think you can argue against a parent's decision to help out their kid.

Thoughtful arguments on both sides.

[HS Football Fanatic]

HS Football Fanatic,

Let me take it beyond transfers between Hawaii schools.

Sol-Jay Maiava got a Michigan offer by then and still current HC Jim Harbaugh when he was 13, not even in high school. Big news. He wound up as the starter in his freshman year and threw for around 800 yards. I remember posting back then that if Kahuku remained ground and pound oriented that that Michigan offer would never materialize in the end. If he stayed at Kahuku,he would never have passed for 2500+ yards a year and kept UM's interest. As we know now,he goes to a DC hs and has put up huge passing numbers and is getting in line for a Power 5 chance.

Parents ,rightly so realize education is key,and athletics are one way to ease the financial burden,so.....sometimes many families believe that ,if their kid has promise in the classroom and football field then they will send them to Bishop Gorman,Orem,Silverado etc on the Mainland to get their kids more exposure.

It makes shambles of the be true to your school concept I was raised with. That said,I don't think you can argue against a parent's decision to help out their kid.

Thoughtful arguments on both sides.

@unpaid: OK, but what does that kind of parental behavior teach kids? It teaches kids to be mercenaries. It teaches kids that everything is for sale to the highest bidder, so to speak. I think we need to go back to old-time values, where people do things because they're the right thing to do. Too many people are selling their souls to the devil nowadays. People need to stop seeing high school football players as commodities, I think.

[gopunahou]

On the subject of Kahuku, does anyone know if they are sticking with Sterling or hiring somebody else? And why is Campbell considering changing coaches?

[HS Football Fanatic]

On the subject of Kahuku, does anyone know if they are sticking with Sterling or hiring somebody else? And why is Campbell considering changing coaches?

@gopunahou: I'm only guessing, but I would have to think Kahuku High is dumping Carvalho. I mean, Kahuku High is like the St Louis School of the OIA. Losing in football does not sit well with them. It's like they would kill someone for less.

[genks]

HS Football Fanatic,

Let me take it beyond transfers between Hawaii schools.

Sol-Jay Maiava got a Michigan offer by then and still current HC Jim Harbaugh when he was 13, not even in high school. Big news. He wound up as the starter in his freshman year and threw for around 800 yards. I remember posting back then that if Kahuku remained ground and pound oriented that that Michigan offer would never materialize in the end. If he stayed at Kahuku,he would never have passed for 2500+ yards a year and kept UM's interest. As we know now,he goes to a DC hs and has put up huge passing numbers and is getting in line for a Power 5 chance.

Parents ,rightly so realize education is key,and athletics are one way to ease the financial burden,so.....sometimes many families believe that ,if their kid has promise in the classroom and football field then they will send them to Bishop Gorman,Orem,Silverado etc on the Mainland to get their kids more exposure.

It makes shambles of the be true to your school concept I was raised with. That said,I don't think you can argue against a parent's decision to help out their kid.

Thoughtful arguments on both sides.

@unpaid: OK, but what does that kind of parental behavior teach kids? It teaches kids to be mercenaries. It teaches kids that everything is for sale to the highest bidder, so to speak. I think we need to go back to old-time values, where people do things because they're the right thing to do. Too many people are selling their souls to the devil nowadays. People need to stop seeing high school football players as commodities, I think.

I think YOU look at players like commodities. You are talking about “right thing to do” and being “mercenaries” and “selling souls”. You talk about how you hope player A from PUN transfers to mililani and player B from STL transfers to mililani. I doubt any of that is because you care for that individual student athlete. It’s so PUN and STL can be beaten plain and simple.

How the hell are you going to talk about school loyalty? You don’t support your alma mater, you jumped right off of Kahuku’s fan base as soon as it looked like Mililani was the best OIA team. You have zero loyalty yet a student athlete should show loyalty to a school because his parents bought a home in that district?

[gopunahou]

On the subject of Kahuku, does anyone know if they are sticking with Sterling or hiring somebody else? And why is Campbell considering changing coaches?

@gopunahou: I'm only guessing, but I would have to think Kahuku High is dumping Carvalho. I mean, Kahuku High is like the St Louis School of the OIA. Losing in football does not sit well with them. It's like they would kill someone for less.

I wonder if the post-Mariota and pre-Tua years made the blood of St. Louis fans boil.

[genks]

Are we at the point of free agency in Hawaii hs football?

OIA-OIA transfers can happen,although the OIA is reviewing their rules,and might make them more restrictive,as in you have to sit out a year. Transfers between the OIA and ILH,no sit out years.

I bring this up because transfers have been increasingly getting more attention even down at the HS level in Hawaii and the other 49 as well. I think it's interesting for fall 2019 for a few reasons.

St. Francis has several standout fb players who have to finish their secondary school somewhere. What school do these players pick? It has been posted by another board member that rumor,take it for what it's worth, indicates that some ILH standouts might be transferring to OIA schools for 2019.

The ILH has always had the rep of recruiting public schools talent even back in my HS days in the late 60's. It seems to me that the pendulum swings both ways. At some point stockpiling the best talent fails you, because there are only so many starting positions up for grabs. When a lot of your second and third stringers realize they could be starting somewhere else and building recruiting interest from colleges,instead of waiting to maybe start their senior year and get D-II or D-III offer because they basically had a one year shot at proving what they could do,what would you do or have your kid do? Might have them go to a school where they can start and still compete for a title.

Is free agency here in Hs football?

I have 2 thoughts

1. I believe it trickles down from college. These kids have the college mindset of seeing their favorite players transfer schools for playing time. They feel the need to do the same thing. They feel getting the next step to a power 5 team is like the college player taking the next step to the pros. Many players and their families probably believe that if only that kid had more playing time, he would definitely get offers like player A or B because he feels he’s better. Or they may feel another school’s scheme may allow the kid to fully show his/her talents. I agree with you that talented back ups will end up transferring since the OIA almost encourages transferring having no rules or stipulations. St Louis is soooo fortunate that Chevan did not transfer. He sat behind Tua, continued his training under Coach Passas and did great once he finally took the helm.

2. The complaining is always one sided when it comes to transferring. No one complained when Dylan Toilolo transferred to Kapolei, when Vegas transferred to Mililani, etc but ILH schools “rip off” players. Should private schools not be allowed to have sports programs? Because private schools have no district. Is Mililani ripping off players or it’s only ripping off when it’s to an ILH school? How about Campbell? It’s obvious that no one will complain about a 3rd team undersized player going to St Louis but Tui was ripped off from McKinley. Give me a break.

Over all if it’s legal then go for it. But let’s not have double standards about transferring.

[Markeke]

With a team roster of 100, StL.has a lot of bench dwellers. Nothing wrong with transferring out to Mililani because of possible playing time. I just wondering how the administration at a large school like Mililani can balance thing off on the academic side.

[HS Football Fanatic]

HS Football Fanatic,

Let me take it beyond transfers between Hawaii schools.

Sol-Jay Maiava got a Michigan offer by then and still current HC Jim Harbaugh when he was 13, not even in high school. Big news. He wound up as the starter in his freshman year and threw for around 800 yards. I remember posting back then that if Kahuku remained ground and pound oriented that that Michigan offer would never materialize in the end. If he stayed at Kahuku,he would never have passed for 2500+ yards a year and kept UM's interest. As we know now,he goes to a DC hs and has put up huge passing numbers and is getting in line for a Power 5 chance.

Parents ,rightly so realize education is key,and athletics are one way to ease the financial burden,so.....sometimes many families believe that ,if their kid has promise in the classroom and football field then they will send them to Bishop Gorman,Orem,Silverado etc on the Mainland to get their kids more exposure.

It makes shambles of the be true to your school concept I was raised with. That said,I don't think you can argue against a parent's decision to help out their kid.

Thoughtful arguments on both sides.

@unpaid: OK, but what does that kind of parental behavior teach kids? It teaches kids to be mercenaries. It teaches kids that everything is for sale to the highest bidder, so to speak. I think we need to go back to old-time values, where people do things because they're the right thing to do. Too many people are selling their souls to the devil nowadays. People need to stop seeing high school football players as commodities, I think.

I think YOU look at players like commodities. You are talking about “right thing to do” and being “mercenaries” and “selling souls”. You talk about how you hope player A from PUN transfers to mililani and player B from STL transfers to mililani. I doubt any of that is because you care for that individual student athlete. It’s so PUN and STL can be beaten plain and simple.

How the hell are you going to talk about school loyalty? You don’t support your alma mater, you jumped right off of Kahuku’s fan base as soon as it looked like Mililani was the best OIA team. You have zero loyalty yet a student athlete should show loyalty to a school because his parents bought a home in that district?

@genks: Well, about those Punahou School and St Louis School players who allegedly are considering transferring. Yes, I encourage them to do so, because yes, I want to see Punahou School and St Louis School beaten. But, notice how I'm focusing on the schools. If those potential Punahou and St Louis transfers actually do transfer, there's nothing I can do about it. But, yes, if they do transfer, they will (hopefully) help in my hope of seeing the Puns and Crusaders lose.

You have the wrong take on my notion of players as commodities. When I said that, I was aiming that criticism at parents who have their boys transfer to this school or that based on boosting their college prospects. I wasn't talking about high schools. I'm a UH alumnus, and I have had it up to my keister seeing our blue-chip players going to mainland colleges because they think UH "isn't good enough." See the difference? Here, let me give you an example: Let's say a St Louis player transfers to Mililani High. Do you think he's doing that because his college prospects would then be brighter? I doubt it. I think most guys would agree that St Louis School has a higher standing in football then Mililani High. But, let's say a part-Hawaiian player from Moanalua High transfers to, say, Kamehameha Schools. If he did that solely to boost his prospects for college, then I would call that mercenary. But notice that that has nothing to do with Moanalua High or Kamehameha Schools. I.e., if we're talking about high schools, for me it's solely about seeing schools I dislike, lose. Only when we're talking about "boosting one's stock" for college, would I use the term, "mercenary." As a UH alumnus, UH is the only college I care about, if we're going to talk about college ball. Other than that, my focus is high school. Look at my User Name, "HS Football Fanatic." The "HS" stands for High School.


You're the second guy to needle me for not revealing my high school alma mater. Again, I do that for two reasons: 1.) My high school alma mater sucks. 2.) If I did reveal my alma mater, it would not only hinder my objectivity when I post, but it might identify me personally, which would further hinder my objectivity. I give you credit for revealing your alma mater, St Louis School. I think that takes a certain amount of courage. But, what might have made it a bit easier to do so is that St Louis School doesn't suck. How willing would you have been to reveal your alma mater if it sucked? Then you say I don't support my alma mater. You apparently assume that, simply because I say it sucks. When I say my alma mater sucks, I'm simply stating a fact. But, what you don't know is that I follow my alma mater very closely, and keep track of how it does in sports. See? That's something you didn't know. If I "don't support my alma mater," why would I follow it closely, to see how they do in sports? Why would I care? I love it when my alma mater wins; it makes me feel good inside. Trouble is, they usually don't win. But, I follow them. If I "don't care about my alma mater," why do I feel good when they win? If I "don't care about them," it wouldn't make a difference one way or another. Therefore, I wouldn't even follow them. People get on this thread and jump to conclusions, making all sorts of unwarranted assumptions. I hope this post has helped clear the air. People get on this thread and pound away on the keyboard, thinking they know absolutely everything about other guys on it. They think they know the guy's soul. To add insult to injury, those people are pretty rude and curt about it, too. Too bad more guys can't be like gopunahou. I can't stand his alma mater, but he has to one of the nicest guys on this message-board. I can't recall the last time he posted anything that I found offensive. He is almost never rude, and I can't recall the last time he called someone out in a way that was very impolite. If you happen to be reading this, gopunahou, your on-line demeanor is an absolute credit to your alma mater. Just by carrying yourself the way you do on-line, I think you bring honor to Punahou School as one of its alumni.