6 returning starters

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J-Rod
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6 returning starters

#1 Post by J-Rod » Sun May 20, 2018 4:52 pm

Grabbed my Athlon college football preview magazine today. They forecast Hawaii to finish 5th in the West and repeat their 2017 3-10 record.

They mostly stated the obvious...with only 2 returning starters on offense and 4 on defense, that's too much to overcome despite the return of the R&S. That seems to be par for the course when it comes to expectations.

So I'll leave this question for the thread: why will Hawaii out-perform expectations? The college football world expects a heavily inexperienced squad to stink it up. If UH is to beat the odds, what must happen?

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Re: 6 returning starters

#2 Post by My3Cats » Mon May 21, 2018 9:30 am

Firstly and most importantly, all of the coaches and all of the players must not only buy into the program and team, but have a never say die attitude and belief in each other. Good team chemistry can overcome some deficiencies, just as poor team chemistry can be disastrous. Problems last season in these areas provided the end result. No divas and no drama needed.
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Re: 6 returning starters

#3 Post by cabanalane » Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:05 pm

I think there is pressure on Rolo. That's why the R&S is back.

I actually think with D. Brown, the team would rank higher by keeping the same system and offense. If I say UH will be 7-6 with Brown (the old system), you may predict something different, but can agree with me, right? Naturally, we expect all the returning players to improve, including non-starters.

Instead, everything is all new. It's either going to be magic, or blows up.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#4 Post by akuhead2 » Sun Jun 17, 2018 2:11 pm

It's going to be magic!

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Re: 6 returning starters

#5 Post by shrek2 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:59 am

Even though Fresno State was 1-11 in 2016 and was ranked at the bottom, I knew that because Jeff Tedford was coming in 2017 that Fresno State was going to be a tough team to beat regardless of who the quarterback was going to be and they were ranked last in preseason 2017. Fresno State went 10-4 in 2017. I don't get the same feeling with Rolo. Two non-winning regular seasons. Its tough to keep players and increase attendance without winning. Like they say, winning isn't everything, its the …. Is this Chow part 2?

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Re: 6 returning starters

#6 Post by J-Rod » Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:52 am

shrek2 wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:59 am
Even though Fresno State was 1-11 in 2016 and was ranked at the bottom, I knew that because Jeff Tedford was coming in 2017 that Fresno State was going to be a tough team to beat regardless of who the quarterback was going to be and they were ranked last in preseason 2017. Fresno State went 10-4 in 2017. I don't get the same feeling with Rolo. Two non-winning regular seasons. Its tough to keep players and increase attendance without winning. Like they say, winning isn't everything, its the …. Is this Chow part 2?
That Fresno team had more returning starters than all 129 other teams. Tedford is a genius, but he inherited a very experienced team, much like DeRuyter did in 2012. Same with June Jones in 1999 (and came back to Earth in 2000 when those starters graduated). Having experience certainly helps in bouncing back. I have no idea if Rolo is the answer or not, but with an anemic 6 returning starters total...this won't be the year for judgment. That comes in 2019 and 2020.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#7 Post by My3Cats » Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:05 am

The projection to finish next to last in the west sounds about right, with all of the changes throughout the roster and coaching staff. Tedford scored when he secured McMaryion and managed to get the whole team to buy into what he was selling. Rolo failed to recruit a quarterback last season to immediately compete with the returning quarterbacks, and failed to recruit a quarterback this coming season from the JC ranks or a graduate transfer to immediately compete, before and after being shocked by Brown's transfer announcement. Looks like another rebuilding year, but hopefully there will be a lot of positives by the end of the season.
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Re: 6 returning starters

#8 Post by J-Rod » Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:56 am

My3Cats wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:05 am
The projection to finish next to last in the west sounds about right, with all of the changes throughout the roster and coaching staff. Tedford scored when he secured McMaryion and managed to get the whole team to buy into what he was selling. Rolo failed to recruit a quarterback last season to immediately compete with the returning quarterbacks, and failed to recruit a quarterback this coming season from the JC ranks or a graduate transfer to immediately compete, before and after being shocked by Brown's transfer announcement. Looks like another rebuilding year, but hopefully there will be a lot of positives by the end of the season.
We've tried bandaids for years now. JC, grad transfer, other transfers...none of it worked. I'm okay with playing Moussa or Cordeiro. If we gone lose, let's build towards something. No more constant turnover at QB.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#9 Post by shrek2 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:36 pm

I don't know why people are still bringing up Drew Brown and how much UH would be better if he were available. I don't think he had arm strength to throw the ball on the outside shoulder accurately to the wide receivers. His strength would have been that he knows the slots and wide receivers but he mostly used Ursua. When Ursua went out with injuries it was three and out. In comparison, who would have thought a 5'11" Milton MacKenzie would be one of the top quarterbacks in FBS who spread the ball around. Its all in the coaching. I hope Brown proves me wrong but I think he's not starting next year at OSU but contributing to the scout team.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#10 Post by J-Rod » Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:50 am

Everything I've read from the Oklahoma State media suggests Dru is going to be holding a clipboard this fall. He's running 4th in a battle of 4-5 QBs. Just not as talented as the other competitors.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#11 Post by My3Cats » Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:34 am

J-Rod wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:56 am
My3Cats wrote:
Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:05 am
The projection to finish next to last in the west sounds about right, with all of the changes throughout the roster and coaching staff. Tedford scored when he secured McMaryion and managed to get the whole team to buy into what he was selling. Rolo failed to recruit a quarterback last season to immediately compete with the returning quarterbacks, and failed to recruit a quarterback this coming season from the JC ranks or a graduate transfer to immediately compete, before and after being shocked by Brown's transfer announcement. Looks like another rebuilding year, but hopefully there will be a lot of positives by the end of the season.
We've tried bandaids for years now. JC, grad transfer, other transfers...none of it worked. I'm okay with playing Moussa or Cordeiro. If we gone lose, let's build towards something. No more constant turnover at QB.
Sometimes, the bandaids work out. Rolo was a bandaid. Moniz was a bandaid. Alexander and Rausch were bandaids (too bad they both got injured). Injuries at the position necessitate the need to have a stable of quarterbacks. I'm also okay with playing Moussa and Cordeiro. JJ always had a lot of quarterbacks on his teams. You could also list Brennan as a bandaid, although he did come in as a sophomore from a JC.
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Re: 6 returning starters

#12 Post by cabanalane » Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:25 am

Why did I bring back D. Brown? Not because I think he is the Answer for UH. Not because he is the "best." It's more because he deserve the chance to mature as a Senior. Senior usually bring another layer of experience and skill set.

I felt the same with Woolsey. He never got his Senior year. Because he was not the starter, the skill set and motivation went downhill.

Maybe I'm setting the bar low. I'm not talking about a 11-2 season. I'm just setting the very reachable bar of 7-6. I think there were indications that it could happen, given the commitment.

What if this new system and QB is not working in week 5. Change the QB? I'm just looking for consistency and aim for C+ or B- as a team.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#13 Post by J-Rod » Wed Jun 20, 2018 1:20 pm

My3Cats wrote:
Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:34 am
Sometimes, the bandaids work out. Rolo was a bandaid. Moniz was a bandaid. Alexander and Rausch were bandaids (too bad they both got injured). Injuries at the position necessitate the need to have a stable of quarterbacks. I'm also okay with playing Moussa and Cordeiro. JJ always had a lot of quarterbacks on his teams. You could also list Brennan as a bandaid, although he did come in as a sophomore from a JC.
The most recent of those listed players is Moniz in 2012. That's 6 years of trying bandaids and failing. It's time for something new. If Cordeiro, Moussa, etc. fail, fine...back to bandaids. But let's give young, organically developed talent a chance for once.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#14 Post by shrek2 » Wed Jun 20, 2018 4:22 pm

cabanalane wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:25 am
Why did I bring back D. Brown? Not because I think he is the Answer for UH. Not because he is the "best." It's more because he deserve the chance to mature as a Senior. Senior usually bring another layer of experience and skill set.

I felt the same with Woolsey. He never got his Senior year. Because he was not the starter, the skill set and motivation went downhill.

Maybe I'm setting the bar low. I'm not talking about a 11-2 season. I'm just setting the very reachable bar of 7-6. I think there were indications that it could happen, given the commitment.

What if this new system and QB is not working in week 5. Change the QB? I'm just looking for consistency and aim for C+ or B- as a team.
I think we have to remember that Dru Brown left for greener pastures and Rolo attempted to discourage him from leaving. Brown replaced Woosley in Woosley's senior year and Woosley still kept on bleeding green even though he was replaced. When Brown was hit out of bounds on the Hawaii sidelines, it was Woosley who went after the other team and got called for personal foul. Although I don't think Woosley wasn't that mature, he went on from UH to ply his trade as a quarterback in Japan.

In 2000, Timmy Chang and Nick Rolovich competed for starting quarterback. Rolovich started but was replaced by Chang in 2000 with the reverse happening in 2001 when Hawaii had an amazing season capped by a blowout win over 9th ranked BYU. All of this was due to the coaching in my personal opinion. JJ was not afraid to pull the trigger and put in a new quarterback. Jason Wheldon replaced Timmy Chang in the only game UH beat Alabama because JJ felt he could get more productivity from Wheldon. In my opinion, 2018 can be like 2000 where there are quarterback options. Can the coaching bring the best out of the talent? The polls say no.

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Re: 6 returning starters

#15 Post by RedZone » Wed Jun 20, 2018 7:47 pm

J-Rod wrote:
Tue Jun 19, 2018 5:50 am
Everything I've read from the Oklahoma State media suggests Dru is going to be holding a clipboard this fall. He's running 4th in a battle of 4-5 QBs. Just not as talented as the other competitors.
Dru looked small over here. He will look tiny over there. Their probable starter is 6’6”. His backup is 6’5”. They have a rehabbing 4 star and a 6’7” who may end up being 270 lbs. But the thing is their best quarterback maybe an incoming freshman. Their coach has been known to start freshman if he felt that the upperclassmen weren’t doing their jobs. It will be interesting to see how things work out for Dru there. It really doesn’t matter to me which way it goes. Rolo gave him the only scholarship offer to a D1 program. He also gave him the starting job. Dru repays him by leaving when Rolo really needed his help. Another player who used UH as a stepping stone.
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