Way too early top ten

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Re: Way too early top ten

#46 Post by HS Football Fanatic » Tue May 15, 2018 5:58 pm

unpaid wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 4:49 pm
HS Football Fanatic,

We all have our own opinions of how teams rank, but I do try to inform myself on what hs coaches think about who has the best returning impact player numbers based on how they voted on media all-state teams. These coaches can see which players from other schools pass the eye test. Most programs that regularly appear in the top ten also have a number of solid role players who do not make all-state teams.So,all things being equal on solid base players, I tend to favor teams who have a large number of all-state returnees. Any tiebreakers are based on recent had to head results. So......

Kahuku is loaded with seven guys who meets the all-state criteria to go with good numbers of solid athletes. They are my preseason number one. Mililani also has seven all-staters,but Kahuku beat them last year. My numbers suggest Kahuku will beat Mililani this coming fall too.

Punahou has six all-state talents returning to complement the Buffanblu squad,so I put them at two.

Kamehameha has five all-state players returning, compared to St. Louis' four, hence my placing Kamehameha at four and St.Louis at five.
@unpaid: Thanks for your response. I'm glad to hear your rationale for why Kahuku should be considered #1. I'm not at all happy that Punahou is as high as #2, but, I guess things are what they are. If any Kahuku players/coaches are reading this, please beat Punahou; keep them at #2. (Sorry, gopunahou). Also, I'm glad that you rank Kamehameha over St Louis, as I do prefer Kamehameha Schools to St Louis School. However, I'm having a hard time believing it in my head and my gut. I mean, Kamehameha has neither a good QB nor a good RB. I still think that those are the two most important positions in football. St Louis apparently has a QB (De Laura) who's going to surprise a lot of people. So, Kamehameha may indeed have one more all-state player than St Louis, but is that enough to rank them ahead of St Louis? I mean, I'd like to believe it, but I find it difficult to actually believe. Not only that; Kamehameha always seems to choke against St Louis. Like, when was the last time they beat them?

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Re: Way too early top ten

#47 Post by genks » Tue May 15, 2018 10:39 pm

I think this schedule is a very good chance for Kam to get some respect. People are so used to seeing Kam getting demolished by STL and Punahou. I think last year someone had ranked Campbell over Kam which last year I thought was rediculous. They are different teams this year from last but they will play each other.

Yes I think it’s silly to rank Kam over STL

Yes I am very biased and look at everything through Crusader goggles

Yes we 100% need to beat them to advance

But I do respect the program and I do believe they are a tough team. Good chance they will be slow on offense but they should be good on defense and they should have a decent if not good offensive line.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#48 Post by genks » Tue May 15, 2018 10:54 pm

Punahou is a question mark to me. Brady, Tufono, Liufau, and most others that people name were on the Pun team last year that barely beat Kam, partly due to a Kam fumble, then went on to lose to Kam allowing 40ish points. I do think Barber played that last game tho not Brady.

So everyone that rank Pun over STL and Kam are basically either

A: Base this heavily on players Kam and STL lost to graduation. So saying the Kam team that beat Pun isn’t the same team, and expected to be worse than last year, same with STL

Or

B: Trust that we will se a large improvement from these players? A larger improvement than STL and Kam?

A large part of the strong returning Pun players battled and lost to Kam, and lost pretty big to STL.

I don’t mean any disrespect to Punahou and gopunahou. I’m just curious and asking for the sake of conversation.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#49 Post by gopunahou » Wed May 16, 2018 12:27 am

genks wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 10:54 pm
Punahou is a question mark to me. Brady, Tufono, Liufau, and most others that people name were on the Pun team last year that barely beat Kam, partly due to a Kam fumble, then went on to lose to Kam allowing 40ish points. I do think Barber played that last game tho not Brady.

So everyone that rank Pun over STL and Kam are basically either

A: Base this heavily on players Kam and STL lost to graduation. So saying the Kam team that beat Pun isn’t the same team, and expected to be worse than last year, same with STL

Or

B: Trust that we will se a large improvement from these players? A larger improvement than STL and Kam?

A large part of the strong returning Pun players battled and lost to Kam, and lost pretty big to STL.

I don’t mean any disrespect to Punahou and gopunahou. I’m just curious and asking for the sake of conversation.
I hate to use injuries as an explanation, but the hope is that Sitiveni, who missed almost all of last year, will play. I am expecting big improvement from Brady and two other offensive players who were just sophomores last year, although it ain't a guarantee that Brady will be our starter (he'll start the 1st game but might lose out to Lohgan, who is a sophomore, should Lohgan impress). I don't think our last loss was the defense's fault, as our offense gave KSK a touchdown and committed various turnovers in our own territory. Barber also played that game injured and, IIRC, didn't finish it. The keys to a better season than last for us will be a healthy Sitiveni and twin offensive junior terrors (I'm letting our opponents learn their names the hard way), smart offensive playcalling (something that was nonexistent last year), and solid leadership from our defense.
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Re: Way too early top ten

#50 Post by ka'ahupahau706 » Wed May 16, 2018 7:31 am

HS Football Fanatic wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:21 pm
@ka'ahupahau706: You have St Louis and Mililani ranked ahead of Kahuku? Most other guys have Kahuku ranked first. OK, all you other guys out there: Which school do you think is #1, and why? (I prefer Kahuku High to both St Louis School and Mililani High, so I'm hoping to see reasons why Kahuku should be #1.)
Saint Louis will be ranked #1 until they are dethroned. They have a solid defense coming back and oline. They are a system program meaning their QB will be solid whoever is next. Mililani doesn't have that edge over Saint Louis.
I think I have Mililani ranked high because this is Mililani's "class," York has bred Gabriel for this final home stretch with this group. Defense is always suspect, but we'll see how it works out.
Kahuku will always be tough, but new coach, new qb, new running back probably coming in from Utah who knows LOL just kidding red raider fans, but not really. But I think it might be a ground and pound attack again vs spreading it out like last year. I'm not sure how the new head coach ran his offense on JV, but from what I hear. Everyone likes him. So we shall see.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#51 Post by ka'ahupahau706 » Wed May 16, 2018 7:34 am

gopunahou wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 4:25 pm
ka'ahupahau706 wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 8:19 am
4. Punahou
(This is an interesting team this year because on paper, they should be really good. Majority of OLine returns, all Receivers return except one. They return their speedy running back and their power guy who is fast as well who is also gaining national attention I think he's 6'2 230? They have a QB battle, but from what I saw last year. Brady was better anyway, so their in better hands this year. Defensively they lose their 2 Dline guys, but return everyone else including Oregon offer Marist Liufau and National Recruit Maninoa Tufono at Linebacker. But STL has been their kryptonite the last few years so we'll see how they do this year.
It helps that both of our QBs are talented underclassmen, but it'd suck if there is a QB controversy. Avoiding injuries can help us stay in contention longer than we did last year, when injuries ravaged us. I think Kennedy Freeman will be our leader at D-Line.
No controversy this year, that was last year between who should've started the last game between Barber or Brady. This year should be interesting because you have Brady and that Kobe kid (Who's a year younger than Brady) battling for QB spot. Both good kids off the field from what I hear. Punahou did have a lot of key injuries.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#52 Post by ka'ahupahau706 » Wed May 16, 2018 7:43 am

gopunahou wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 12:27 am
genks wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 10:54 pm
Punahou is a question mark to me. Brady, Tufono, Liufau, and most others that people name were on the Pun team last year that barely beat Kam, partly due to a Kam fumble, then went on to lose to Kam allowing 40ish points. I do think Barber played that last game tho not Brady.

So everyone that rank Pun over STL and Kam are basically either

A: Base this heavily on players Kam and STL lost to graduation. So saying the Kam team that beat Pun isn’t the same team, and expected to be worse than last year, same with STL

Or

B: Trust that we will se a large improvement from these players? A larger improvement than STL and Kam?

A large part of the strong returning Pun players battled and lost to Kam, and lost pretty big to STL.

I don’t mean any disrespect to Punahou and gopunahou. I’m just curious and asking for the sake of conversation.
I hate to use injuries as an explanation, but the hope is that Sitiveni, who missed almost all of last year, will play. I am expecting big improvement from Brady and two other offensive players who were just sophomores last year, although it ain't a guarantee that Brady will be our starter (he'll start the 1st game but might lose out to Lohgan, who is a sophomore, should Lohgan impress). I don't think our last loss was the defense's fault, as our offense gave KSK a touchdown and committed various turnovers in our own territory. Barber also played that game injured and, IIRC, didn't finish it. The keys to a better season than last for us will be a healthy Sitiveni and twin offensive junior terrors (I'm letting our opponents learn their names the hard way), smart offensive playcalling (something that was nonexistent last year), and solid leadership from our defense.
The key on offense with Punahou is not only Sitiveni, but Vincent at RB as well. He might be one of faster running backs in the state this year. They also have that Tamatoa kid and Eldredge coming back at Receiver. On the O-line, they lose 3 big starters. So we'll see who they come up with to protect the QB. As far as smart playcalling, you're right. That was nonexistent. But I couldn't tell if that was bad play calling or terrible reads from Barber all last year? Hopefully he does well in college.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#53 Post by rrforlifebaby » Wed May 16, 2018 9:31 am

ka'ahupahau706 wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 7:31 am
HS Football Fanatic wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:21 pm
@ka'ahupahau706: You have St Louis and Mililani ranked ahead of Kahuku? Most other guys have Kahuku ranked first. OK, all you other guys out there: Which school do you think is #1, and why? (I prefer Kahuku High to both St Louis School and Mililani High, so I'm hoping to see reasons why Kahuku should be #1.)
Saint Louis will be ranked #1 until they are dethroned. They have a solid defense coming back and oline. They are a system program meaning their QB will be solid whoever is next. Mililani doesn't have that edge over Saint Louis.
I think I have Mililani ranked high because this is Mililani's "class," York has bred Gabriel for this final home stretch with this group. Defense is always suspect, but we'll see how it works out.
Kahuku will always be tough, but new coach, new qb, new running back probably coming in from Utah who knows LOL just kidding red raider fans, but not really. But I think it might be a ground and pound attack again vs spreading it out like last year. I'm not sure how the new head coach ran his offense on JV, but from what I hear. Everyone likes him. So we shall see.
Based on what he did at the JV level, Sterling believes in the traditional running game, but has no qualms about throwing the ball. I think we'll eventually see balanced attack. Alapa is a great athlete with a pretty good arm; last year's JV QB has good size and a good arm as well. I think with less focus on just one player, this year's O will have a much smoother flow. No doubt, the D will be tested every week, but as I mentioned earlier, I believe this years group of kids has the makings of being another special squad.

Re St Louis' new qb, I have no doubt that this kid will have that WoW factor.

RRFL!

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Re: Way too early top ten

#54 Post by HS Football Fanatic » Wed May 16, 2018 2:10 pm

genks wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 10:39 pm
I think this schedule is a very good chance for Kam to get some respect. People are so used to seeing Kam getting demolished by STL and Punahou. I think last year someone had ranked Campbell over Kam which last year I thought was rediculous. They are different teams this year from last but they will play each other.

Yes I think it’s silly to rank Kam over STL

Yes I am very biased and look at everything through Crusader goggles

Yes we 100% need to beat them to advance

But I do respect the program and I do believe they are a tough team. Good chance they will be slow on offense but they should be good on defense and they should have a decent if not good offensive line.
@genks: Well, I want to be fair. Kamehameha did finish ahead of Punahou last year, so they should be given credit for that. Problem is, they're losing a lot of that team's starters to graduation, while Punahou is returning a lot of their own starters. Yes, it seems that Kamehameha always has a good D and a good O-line each year, but that's simply not enough, usually. (Again, they did finish ahead of Punahou last season). Kamehameha won't have a good QB, and they won't have a good RB. That doesn't bode well for them at all. Looks like they'll replace Punahou as cellar-dweller of ILH D1 this coming season.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#55 Post by HS Football Fanatic » Wed May 16, 2018 4:56 pm

genks wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 10:54 pm
Punahou is a question mark to me. Brady, Tufono, Liufau, and most others that people name were on the Pun team last year that barely beat Kam, partly due to a Kam fumble, then went on to lose to Kam allowing 40ish points. I do think Barber played that last game tho not Brady.

So everyone that rank Pun over STL and Kam are basically either

A: Base this heavily on players Kam and STL lost to graduation. So saying the Kam team that beat Pun isn’t the same team, and expected to be worse than last year, same with STL

Or

B: Trust that we will se a large improvement from these players? A larger improvement than STL and Kam?

A large part of the strong returning Pun players battled and lost to Kam, and lost pretty big to STL.

I don’t mean any disrespect to Punahou and gopunahou. I’m just curious and asking for the sake of conversation.
@genks: The thing about St Louis School is, they don't rebuild; they reload. The same cannot be said for Kamehameha Schools. With them, it's feast or famine, usually famine. They lose a lot of talented players to graduation, that's it; they're crippled the following season. There's no "reloading," a la St Louis. What it boils down to is that St Louis School is a football factory, or, should I say, a football team factory.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#56 Post by HS Football Fanatic » Wed May 16, 2018 5:10 pm

rrforlifebaby wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 9:31 am
ka'ahupahau706 wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 7:31 am
HS Football Fanatic wrote:
Tue May 15, 2018 3:21 pm
@ka'ahupahau706: You have St Louis and Mililani ranked ahead of Kahuku? Most other guys have Kahuku ranked first. OK, all you other guys out there: Which school do you think is #1, and why? (I prefer Kahuku High to both St Louis School and Mililani High, so I'm hoping to see reasons why Kahuku should be #1.)
Saint Louis will be ranked #1 until they are dethroned. They have a solid defense coming back and oline. They are a system program meaning their QB will be solid whoever is next. Mililani doesn't have that edge over Saint Louis.
I think I have Mililani ranked high because this is Mililani's "class," York has bred Gabriel for this final home stretch with this group. Defense is always suspect, but we'll see how it works out.
Kahuku will always be tough, but new coach, new qb, new running back probably coming in from Utah who knows LOL just kidding red raider fans, but not really. But I think it might be a ground and pound attack again vs spreading it out like last year. I'm not sure how the new head coach ran his offense on JV, but from what I hear. Everyone likes him. So we shall see.
Based on what he did at the JV level, Sterling believes in the traditional running game, but has no qualms about throwing the ball. I think we'll eventually see balanced attack. Alapa is a great athlete with a pretty good arm; last year's JV QB has good size and a good arm as well. I think with less focus on just one player, this year's O will have a much smoother flow. No doubt, the D will be tested every week, but as I mentioned earlier, I believe this years group of kids has the makings of being another special squad.

Re St Louis' new qb, I have no doubt that this kid will have that WoW factor.

RRFL!
@rrforlifebaby: A number of guys have posted that Kahuku's D will be tested every week. Well, every school in that new islandwide Open division will have its D tested every week. It doesn't go only for Kahuku. Anyway, I'm hoping your alma mater takes the Open title. Of the schools with a shot, I like them the most. Go Red Raiders!

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Re: Way too early top ten

#57 Post by genks » Wed May 16, 2018 5:20 pm

Just saw that Kapolei’s 1st and 2nd string QBs are transfering. Huge losses due to transfering and some to graduation at critical positions.

Kapolei’s situation <>= to Kam and Waianae?

One thing I will add, Hernandez couldn’t get it done even with a comepletely loaded roster, I mean top to bottom loaded. Even worse now?

Maybe someone that knows Kapolei and their roster better can chime in?

Also wanted to add that UH just offered Delaura. Since there’s so much talk about him I figured I’d mention that. I can’t wait to see him play

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Re: Way too early top ten

#58 Post by HS Football Fanatic » Wed May 16, 2018 7:14 pm

genks wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 5:20 pm
Just saw that Kapolei’s 1st and 2nd string QBs are transfering. Huge losses due to transfering and some to graduation at critical positions.

Kapolei’s situation <>= to Kam and Waianae?

One thing I will add, Hernandez couldn’t get it done even with a comepletely loaded roster, I mean top to bottom loaded. Even worse now?

Maybe someone that knows Kapolei and their roster better can chime in?

Also wanted to add that UH just offered Delaura. Since there’s so much talk about him I figured I’d mention that. I can’t wait to see him play
@genks: Kapolei High is really snakebitten. They'll get so close to the top some years, and then something goes wrong. Hernandez must be really frustrated; if it's not one thing, it's another. As for De Laura, well, I hope that with him, St Louis can stop Punahou. (Again, sorry, gopunahou.) Also, someone posted that St Louis will have the best D in the state. Hopefully, De Laura + #1 defense = ILH Open title.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#59 Post by genks » Wed May 16, 2018 8:39 pm

HS Football Fanatic wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 7:14 pm
genks wrote:
Wed May 16, 2018 5:20 pm
Just saw that Kapolei’s 1st and 2nd string QBs are transfering. Huge losses due to transfering and some to graduation at critical positions.

Kapolei’s situation <>= to Kam and Waianae?

One thing I will add, Hernandez couldn’t get it done even with a comepletely loaded roster, I mean top to bottom loaded. Even worse now?

Maybe someone that knows Kapolei and their roster better can chime in?

Also wanted to add that UH just offered Delaura. Since there’s so much talk about him I figured I’d mention that. I can’t wait to see him play
@genks: Kapolei High is really snakebitten. They'll get so close to the top some years, and then something goes wrong. Hernandez must be really frustrated; if it's not one thing, it's another. As for De Laura, well, I hope that with him, St Louis can stop Punahou. (Again, sorry, gopunahou.) Also, someone posted that St Louis will have the best D in the state. Hopefully, De Laura + #1 defense = ILH Open title.
I think it was actually best defensive line, not defense in general.

I don’t mean to take credit away from Farrington, but Kapolei really should’ve beaten them in the OIA semis 2 years ago. That roster was so stacked it was crazy. Yet they lost to Farrington, dropped a game against Waianae, and got completely smashed by Kahuku. I know I’ve been critical of Hernandez in the past, not sure if hiring Amosa as OC did him any favors. The team also seems to lack discipline with the bad personal fouls, mouthing off and adding unsportsmanlike penalties, etc.

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Re: Way too early top ten

#60 Post by gopunahou » Wed May 16, 2018 11:02 pm

One fact that KSK and Punahou fans HATE is that Vinny Passas can make anybody look good.
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Or auffrey78!
Or auffrey79!
Oh well, what I really am is an elitist!

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