How to lose your fan base in five steps

Share your news and views about University of Hawaii Warrior Football
UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

10/23/21 5:15 PM 6:00 PM NEW MEXICO STATE $69.99
10/30/21 8:30 AM 9:00 AM UTAH STATE $69.99
11/13/21 10:30 AM 11:00 AM UNLV AWAY. $69.99
11/20/21 5:15 PM 6:00 PM COLORADO STATE $69.99
11/27/21 9:30 AM 10:00 AM WYOMING $69.99

EITSwarrior
Hall of famer
Hall of famer
Posts: 2467
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:40 pm

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by EITSwarrior »

I understand what you’re saying but it is simple economics to be fair.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

EITSwarrior wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:45 pm I understand what you’re saying but it is simple economics to be fair.
Yeh, like a restaurant raising prices because there are not enough customers.

To me it is sad for the players. I could be wrong, maybe we need some polling data. But I think very few in the state know anything about this team. How many fans are they actually playing for? I am watching a great NFL game right now. It is not $70 bucks. LOL. And I am excited about the sport. And I will spend money on gear, travel, hotels. Hawaii football? They make it too hard to stay interested.

User avatar
My3Cats
*True Sports Fan*
*True Sports Fan*
Posts: 3271
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 11:36 am
Location: Mililani, HI

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by My3Cats »

If I'm not mistaken, wasn't PPV before this year $75.00 per game if purchased individually? Save $5.00 per game this year.
Cats don't have owners. Cats have servants.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

My3Cats wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:01 pm If I'm not mistaken, wasn't PPV before this year $75.00 per game if purchased individually? Save $5.00 per game this year.
It’s a broken model. Hard to defend a system that year after year after year dwindles the last remaining fans. And a lot of those fans grow old.

Wyoming should have some buzz and be a springboard for the team and for fans to get excited for next year.

There is no buzz. The game will not bring in new fans. Just another game that hardly any will watch (not for $70) as the fan base will just continue to decline. I apologize to the experts here. They obviously know more than me. They are in charge of this, not me.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

The stadium was nearly full back in the day, but not a sell out, so the game would be a black out. If you don’t make it to the stadium, then listen to 1420 and watch the rerun on KFVE at 10:00 pm. So, a large number of fans stayed connected to the team even if they didn’t make every game. Now very few feel any connection to this team. Five of the last six games are essentially off limits to those that are not going to pay $70 to watch TV. And road PPV? Now that really kills interest. Go do your marketing studies. The goal should be expanding, not contracting the fan base.

EITSwarrior
Hall of famer
Hall of famer
Posts: 2467
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2011 3:40 pm

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by EITSwarrior »

UnBiasFan wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:48 pm
EITSwarrior wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:45 pm I understand what you’re saying but it is simple economics to be fair.
Yeh, like a restaurant raising prices because there are not enough customers.

To me it is sad for the players. I could be wrong, maybe we need some polling data. But I think very few in the state know anything about this team. How many fans are they actually playing for? I am watching a great NFL game right now. It is not $70 bucks. LOL. And I am excited about the sport. And I will spend money on gear, travel, hotels. Hawaii football? They make it too hard to stay interested.
They raised prices cause there are only so many seats available not because there are not enough attendees. That being said they raised it a bit too much for prime seats.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

EITSwarrior wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 7:05 pm
UnBiasFan wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:48 pm
EITSwarrior wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:45 pm I understand what you’re saying but it is simple economics to be fair.
Yeh, like a restaurant raising prices because there are not enough customers.

To me it is sad for the players. I could be wrong, maybe we need some polling data. But I think very few in the state know anything about this team. How many fans are they actually playing for? I am watching a great NFL game right now. It is not $70 bucks. LOL. And I am excited about the sport. And I will spend money on gear, travel, hotels. Hawaii football? They make it too hard to stay interested.
They raised prices cause there are only so many seats available not because there are not enough attendees. That being said they raised it a bit too much for prime seats.

I understand that it isn’t easy to price the seats in a year like this. The bigger issue is that people actually think our PPV pricing is normal.

It’s not. I am guessing this team has the least amount of fan interest in decades.

This is an awful failure. People are saying things like isn’t UH playing tonight? Oh, yeh I forgot my radio. They not even tuning into the radio. No one care. Put the game on regular TV, at least people watch. Next week is a good game. Hardly anyone going to see it.

Great for the brand right? Nobody watching.

poidog
*True Sports Fan*
*True Sports Fan*
Posts: 6219
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 1:15 pm

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by poidog »

UnBiasFan wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 7:18 pm
EITSwarrior wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 7:05 pm
UnBiasFan wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:48 pm

Yeh, like a restaurant raising prices because there are not enough customers.

To me it is sad for the players. I could be wrong, maybe we need some polling data. But I think very few in the state know anything about this team. How many fans are they actually playing for? I am watching a great NFL game right now. It is not $70 bucks. LOL. And I am excited about the sport. And I will spend money on gear, travel, hotels. Hawaii football? They make it too hard to stay interested.
They raised prices cause there are only so many seats available not because there are not enough attendees. That being said they raised it a bit too much for prime seats.

I understand that it isn’t easy to price the seats in a year like this. The bigger issue is that people actually think our PPV pricing is normal.

It’s not. I am guessing this team has the least amount of fan interest in decades.

This is an awful failure. People are saying things like isn’t UH playing tonight? Oh, yeh I forgot my radio. They not even tuning into the radio. No one care. Put the game on regular TV, at least people watch. Next week is a good game. Hardly anyone going to see it.

Great for the brand right? Nobody watching.
Do you have any actual numbers to back any of this up? I'd like to see some real evidence of what you are suggesting because all of the anecdotal evidence that I see tells me that PPV buys are up. Remember that UH gets a bigger TV deal than every other MWC member other than Boise, so if Spectrum is willing to fork up that much cash, people must be buying the PPV. In my own group of 12 season ticket holders, most of them became PPV buyers during the pandemic and I am fairly sure this was the case for a lot of other season ticket holders, so PPV buys likely went up.

I don't think there is a huge group of people who would order the games if the prices were a little lower. Lowering the prices would just decrease revenue gained from those of us who are willing to pay what they are charging. So many people who scoff at $70 probably won't pay $45 on a consistent basis, either.

But hey, feel what you want to feel.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

poidog wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:24 pm

Do you have any actual numbers to back any of this up?
I'd like to see some real evidence of what you are suggesting because all of the anecdotal evidence that I see tells me that PPV buys are up. Remember that UH gets a bigger TV deal than every other MWC member other than Boise, so if Spectrum is willing to fork up that much cash, people must be buying the PPV. In my own group of 12 season ticket holders, most of them became PPV buyers during the pandemic and I am fairly sure this was the case for a lot of other season ticket holders, so PPV buys likely went up.

I don't think there is a huge group of people who would order the games if the prices were a little lower. Lowering the prices would just decrease revenue gained from those of us who are willing to pay what they are charging. So many people who scoff at $70 probably won't pay $45 on a consistent basis, either.

But hey, feel what you want to feel.
No, let’s see the numbers. So we are not talking about feelings. A much huger group would be exposed to the product if was through a regular broadcast. And more in our state could actually get enjoyment from the hard work shown. You know where you turn on your living room TV and the game is on. What I am pointing out is nearly half the season (the second half) was in the dark for most people. Blame the customer if you want.

Do some polling across the state too. I could be dead wrong. But if you only look within your group you will never know.

There will be no Wyoming game for most people in the state. No chance for additional fans to get interested in this team. Because they are essentially blacking out road games for most. A marginal, youthful, or fan with future potential not paying $70 for this game. That is a major joke for anyone outside our little World. And it is failing. Or something is failing. Because, if I am correct, less and less have interest in the product each year. This declinig interest has been going on for years. Worse every year. Von Appen/Chow days still could fill stands. Remember UH is also there to inspire our youth. As many as can. UH football not just for old people you know. But heck, if the old timers can support it and the players don’t mind playing for the dwindling geriatric club, have at it.

User avatar
cabanalane
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1989
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 12:17 pm
Location: I stay on the mainland

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by cabanalane »

I am a fan because I used to stay up late into the night, after the game was over in real time, and watched it on K5 or was that KHNL13. There was no way I could afford any game at any price, as a kid, or with dad's help. Dad was busy working 2 jobs to pay rent.

Today, I've gone across states to see a UH game. Not because I rich, just because can.

What's the point here? In order to create tomorrow's fan, the games got to be free now, in some way.

We don't live in that world anymore. But I don't see any reason NOT to show the games, delayed, a few days or a week later. Sometimes, games are recorded on youtube, hosted by somebody. Not sure if that's really legal or not.

But still, invest in the future fan base. They are going to be your hard core guys a few decades later.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

cabanalane wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:11 am I am a fan because I used to stay up late into the night, after the game was over in real time, and watched it on K5 or was that KHNL13. There was no way I could afford any game at any price, as a kid, or with dad's help. Dad was busy working 2 jobs to pay rent.

Today, I've gone across states to see a UH game. Not because I rich, just because can.

What's the point here? In order to create tomorrow's fan, the games got to be free now, in some way.

We don't live in that world anymore. But I don't see any reason NOT to show the games, delayed, a few days or a week later. Sometimes, games are recorded on youtube, hosted by somebody. Not sure if that's really legal or not.

But still, invest in the future fan base. They are going to be your hard core guys a few decades later.
Part of it is that we distorted the purpose of PPV. It was concocted with the idea that we will offer you an alternative to going to the stadium. So you can watch live at home, even when the stadium not sold out.

Some how it got distorted into cutting off much off the fan base even from road games. So no can follow the team. Plenty people know nothing about this team. They playing for a few thousand or so old timers. They not playing for the whole state. Most of the state don’t even know this team. This is a shame.

poidog
*True Sports Fan*
*True Sports Fan*
Posts: 6219
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 1:15 pm

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by poidog »

cabanalane wrote: Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:11 am I am a fan because I used to stay up late into the night, after the game was over in real time, and watched it on K5 or was that KHNL13. There was no way I could afford any game at any price, as a kid, or with dad's help. Dad was busy working 2 jobs to pay rent.

Today, I've gone across states to see a UH game. Not because I rich, just because can.

What's the point here? In order to create tomorrow's fan, the games got to be free now, in some way.

We don't live in that world anymore. But I don't see any reason NOT to show the games, delayed, a few days or a week later. Sometimes, games are recorded on youtube, hosted by somebody. Not sure if that's really legal or not.

But still, invest in the future fan base. They are going to be your hard core guys a few decades later.
I'm exactly the same way - me and my dad used to stay up to watch the rebroadcast on KHNL/KFVE at 10:30pm when I was a kid. We didn't mind and it was kind of "our thing". That's how I became a fan, because my family didn't go to the games because we just didn't do things like that. So I am right there with you.

The games actually are shown for free the next morning on Spectrum Sports. Unfortunately, not everyone has Spectrum Sports (but a lot of people in Hawaii do). I was hopeful that Hawaii News Now would be able to win the contract at some point, but with Blangiardi no longer there, who knows if they still have the desire to outbid Spectrum for the broadcast rights.

poidog
*True Sports Fan*
*True Sports Fan*
Posts: 6219
Joined: Wed Aug 02, 2006 1:15 pm

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by poidog »

UnBiasFan wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:05 pm
poidog wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:24 pm

Do you have any actual numbers to back any of this up?
I'd like to see some real evidence of what you are suggesting because all of the anecdotal evidence that I see tells me that PPV buys are up. Remember that UH gets a bigger TV deal than every other MWC member other than Boise, so if Spectrum is willing to fork up that much cash, people must be buying the PPV. In my own group of 12 season ticket holders, most of them became PPV buyers during the pandemic and I am fairly sure this was the case for a lot of other season ticket holders, so PPV buys likely went up.

I don't think there is a huge group of people who would order the games if the prices were a little lower. Lowering the prices would just decrease revenue gained from those of us who are willing to pay what they are charging. So many people who scoff at $70 probably won't pay $45 on a consistent basis, either.

But hey, feel what you want to feel.
No, let’s see the numbers. So we are not talking about feelings. A much huger group would be exposed to the product if was through a regular broadcast. And more in our state could actually get enjoyment from the hard work shown. You know where you turn on your living room TV and the game is on. What I am pointing out is nearly half the season (the second half) was in the dark for most people. Blame the customer if you want.

Do some polling across the state too. I could be dead wrong. But if you only look within your group you will never know.

There will be no Wyoming game for most people in the state. No chance for additional fans to get interested in this team. Because they are essentially blacking out road games for most. A marginal, youthful, or fan with future potential not paying $70 for this game. That is a major joke for anyone outside our little World. And it is failing. Or something is failing. Because, if I am correct, less and less have interest in the product each year. This declinig interest has been going on for years. Worse every year. Von Appen/Chow days still could fill stands. Remember UH is also there to inspire our youth. As many as can. UH football not just for old people you know. But heck, if the old timers can support it and the players don’t mind playing for the dwindling geriatric club, have at it.
What's funny is that I pretty much agree with the spirit of what you are saying - I think UH would have a healthier fanbase if the games were on free tv, and I've felt this way for years. But I don't agree with the way you make like everything is SO OBVIOUSLY ONE WAY and with all the assumptions you make, like your assumption that PPV buys are down, based off of nothing but your overall frustrations with everything UH football these days.

In regards to the road game @ Wyoming - why wouldn't Spectrum Sports want to put this game on PPV? They are footing the production costs to set up a crew at a road game at a school that doesn't have their own TV deal. How many commercials would they have to sell to cover those costs if they put the game on TV for free? too many, likely, and it would not be worth the investment. At least this way, the university gets money out of it as part of the 2nd (or 3rd?) biggest TV deal in the conference. For UH road games that don't get picked up by the cable sports networks like CBS Sports, the options are PPV or no TV, like it or not. or in some cases, like with the game @ NMSU I think - we had to subscribe to some off-brand streaming service to watch the game. UH has one of the better TV packages for a program of its stature, and yet people are still very unhappy with it.

I can agree with some of your broader thoughts, but I can't agree with your wishful thinking that things are obviously so easy and are only a result of gross mismanagement by inept leaders. I'd be more on board if you instead said "I think UH should lose money and put games on free TV in effort to invest in acquiring new fans". That I can agree with.

UnBiasFan
All-American
All-American
Posts: 1724
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:28 am

Re: How to lose your fan base in five steps

Post by UnBiasFan »

OK, Poidog, this is where I make peace with your point. Yes, no need to say all are bad, bad, people. They trying. So we want them to try better.

Post Reply