PEYTON MANNING

Talk about sports like the NFL, MLB, NBA, NCAA, Fantasy, Boxing, MMA along with any other sports you follow.
Message
Author
botokuno
Pom pom fluffer
Pom pom fluffer
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 2:11 am

#16 Post by botokuno » Mon Jan 16, 2006 2:27 pm

Your claim that Peyton Manning gets all the credit when they win is baseless. Manning always gives credit where credit is due. He knows how valuable his line is (the one that was "(thrown) under the bus"), the value of his recievers, and the running and blocking of Edgerrin James.

And, while many people say that Manning was throwing his o-line under the bus, I would like to say otherwise. He was speaking out of anger and frustration in a post-game conference that has become all too familiar. The truth of it was there were protection problems; and it wasn't just the offensive line. In the fourth quarter, with the Colts inside of their own 20, both Edgerrin James and Dallas Clark were in the backfield blocking, and Joey Porter still got through twice--once on second down and the second time on fourth down. Why did Porter get through? Because the protection scheme didn't identify Porter's blitz. Who gets the blame for that? Not only the blockers, but also Manning for not identifing the blitz coming from his blindside.

Honestly, I know I sound like an appolgist, and I probably truly am. On the same token, I am growing extremely tired of people who look to throw anything they can at Peyton at any chance they get. The man is as human as any of us, and if we were in the same situation could you honestly say you would be able to keep yourself from saying something you might regret later? I didn't see anyone creating a thread about Tiki Barber saying the Giants were out-coached? How come no one is busting his balls?

This is honestly one of the hardest losses I've ever experienced as a fan. Right up there with the Hornets loosing to the Heat in seven games in the first round of the 2004 NBA Playoffs and the 2004 NFL AFC Championship loss to the Patriots. The Colts had many chances to win that game, so I'm not going to take it away from the Steelers because they played hard all 60 minutes, but at the same time, I don't think the loss can be placed squarely on the shoulders of Peyton Manning because to do so would be to take away some of the victory from the Steelers.

And one last thing, don't say that Peyton disrespected his coach by waving off the punt team. Both you and I, as well as everyone else out there, knows that there is no disrepsect given or even implied by waving off the punt team. When Tony Dungy tried to send the punt team on, he was practicing safe football as a head coach; when Peyton waved them off, he was practicing aggressive football as the highest paid quarterback in the league trying to win the game because that's his job. Plus, with him waving off the punt team, it shows that he has enough confidence in his offense (including his protection) to keep them on the field and not force his defense into a short field. If you want to look for a comprable example, look at the USC-Notre Dame game when Matt Leinart audibled into the fly route to Dwayne Jarrett on 4th-and-9 down the left side of the field. Had the pass not been completed, would he be crucified for not respecting Lane Kiffin and Steve Sarkisian (SC's Co-Offensive Coordinators)? Or what about when Leinart again audibled out of a play called for by the coaches by calling for the goal line sneak instead of the spike to stop the clock and kick the fieldgoal for the tie? Again, is it disrespecting the coach or is it some of that gunslinger attitude that people love about guys like Terry Bradshaw and Brett Favre? Before you decide to be a bunch of god damn haters, think about every angle.

User avatar
lou909
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:24 pm
Location: KALIHI.....OAHU

#17 Post by lou909 » Mon Jan 16, 2006 3:23 pm

botokuno wrote:Your claim that Peyton Manning gets all the credit when they win is baseless. Manning always gives credit where credit is due. He knows how valuable his line is (the one that was "(thrown) under the bus"), the value of his recievers, and the running and blocking of Edgerrin James.

And, while many people say that Manning was throwing his o-line under the bus, I would like to say otherwise. He was speaking out of anger and frustration in a post-game conference that has become all too familiar. The truth of it was there were protection problems; and it wasn't just the offensive line. In the fourth quarter, with the Colts inside of their own 20, both Edgerrin James and Dallas Clark were in the backfield blocking, and Joey Porter still got through twice--once on second down and the second time on fourth down. Why did Porter get through? Because the protection scheme didn't identify Porter's blitz. Who gets the blame for that? Not only the blockers, but also Manning for not identifing the blitz coming from his blindside.

Honestly, I know I sound like an appolgist, and I probably truly am. On the same token, I am growing extremely tired of people who look to throw anything they can at Peyton at any chance they get. The man is as human as any of us, and if we were in the same situation could you honestly say you would be able to keep yourself from saying something you might regret later? I didn't see anyone creating a thread about Tiki Barber saying the Giants were out-coached? How come no one is busting his balls?

This is honestly one of the hardest losses I've ever experienced as a fan. Right up there with the Hornets loosing to the Heat in seven games in the first round of the 2004 NBA Playoffs and the 2004 NFL AFC Championship loss to the Patriots. The Colts had many chances to win that game, so I'm not going to take it away from the Steelers because they played hard all 60 minutes, but at the same time, I don't think the loss can be placed squarely on the shoulders of Peyton Manning because to do so would be to take away some of the victory from the Steelers.

And one last thing, don't say that Peyton disrespected his coach by waving off the punt team. Both you and I, as well as everyone else out there, knows that there is no disrepsect given or even implied by waving off the punt team. When Tony Dungy tried to send the punt team on, he was practicing safe football as a head coach; when Peyton waved them off, he was practicing aggressive football as the highest paid quarterback in the league trying to win the game because that's his job. Plus, with him waving off the punt team, it shows that he has enough confidence in his offense (including his protection) to keep them on the field and not force his defense into a short field. If you want to look for a comprable example, look at the USC-Notre Dame game when Matt Leinart audibled into the fly route to Dwayne Jarrett on 4th-and-9 down the left side of the field. Had the pass not been completed, would he be crucified for not respecting Lane Kiffin and Steve Sarkisian (SC's Co-Offensive Coordinators)? Or what about when Leinart again audibled out of a play called for by the coaches by calling for the goal line sneak instead of the spike to stop the clock and kick the fieldgoal for the tie? Again, is it disrespecting the coach or is it some of that gunslinger attitude that people love about guys like Terry Bradshaw and Brett Favre? Before you decide to be a bunch of god damn haters, think about every angle.
damn... i didn't know peyton's boyfriend posted here..... :-({|=

User avatar
lou909
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:24 pm
Location: KALIHI.....OAHU

Re: PEYTON MANNING

#18 Post by lou909 » Mon Jan 16, 2006 3:32 pm

Pomai44 wrote:
lou909 wrote:......... MY BRONCOS WILL WHUP THE STEELERS..... ALL OF YOU CAN JUMP ON THE BANDWAGON... THERE's LOTS OF ROOM.... IN THE TRUNK!!!!!!!! =;
Your make'in a joke right???? There is no way that Denver can beat the Steelers, [-X they aren't even on the same level Denver is two steps lower. Plummer is going to be sacked so many times he won't see the light of day. If anyone thought that Polamalu had a good game yesterday you haven't seen anything yet. He will be flying in Denver.

Even though Hawaii is home, I was born in Pittsburgh, I think they do something in the hospital when your born that makes you a diehard steelers fan. :lol: [/code]
ohhhh... you better damn well hope that your steelers win cause if they don't.... you better be ready to hear (more like read) it from me..... and when they (steelers) do lose.... you can take your terrible towel turn it sidewayz and stick it right up your CANDY @SS!!!!.......

lewpac
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: Kamuela, HI

#19 Post by lewpac » Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:40 pm

I may be in a serious minority about never really liking Manning.
I don't know if it's just one thing or his whole package.
He comes across a little arrogant at the line of scrimage with that whole field general act, all that pointing and yelling and staring down the defense.
There's this halo about him that indicates that he's ordained to a championship and greatness or something. He's been sainted already because of gaudy numbers and stats. Ask Dan Marino about stats.
If you had to pick between Brady and Manning, who would it be. Brady will never have the stats that Manning does and will not doubt end up with. But Brady's got those three rings. Like Aikman, who will never be confused with an all time great, but will probably be a first ballot Hall of Famer................because of the rings. As far as I can tell, Marino is the only QB without a championship whose name is sometimes used in the same sentence as "greatness", and even he PLAYED in a Super Bowl.
Legends, Hall of Famers, All Time Greats, etc.........never get those labels without championships.
Manning still has time and might pull off an Elway or a Steve Young still, who knows. But until that day, he'll fall behind such names as Brad Johnson, Trent Dilpher, Mark Rypien, Joe Theisman, Phil Simms, Jim Plunkett, Len Dawson, et al...............as a guy with less rings then these household names. Without a ring, he'll be right up there with Fran Tarkenton, Danny White, Warren Moon, Steve Bartkowsky, Joe Kapp, Ron Jawarsky, et al.............as a guy who was darn good, love to have him on my team, and could've had it all but came up short.

User avatar
warriorfan808
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 9206
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2003 3:38 pm
Location: Aiea

#20 Post by warriorfan808 » Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:43 pm

lewpac wrote:I may be in a serious minority about never really liking Manning.
I don't know if it's just one thing or his whole package.
He comes across a little arrogant at the line of scrimage with that whole field general act, all that pointing and yelling and staring down the defense.
There's this halo about him that indicates that he's ordained to a championship and greatness or something. He's been sainted already because of gaudy numbers and stats. Ask Dan Marino about stats.
If you had to pick between Brady and Manning, who would it be. Brady will never have the stats that Manning does and will not doubt end up with. But Brady's got those three rings. Like Aikman, who will never be confused with an all time great, but will probably be a first ballot Hall of Famer................because of the rings. As far as I can tell, Marino is the only QB without a championship whose name is sometimes used in the same sentence as "greatness", and even he PLAYED in a Super Bowl.
Legends, Hall of Famers, All Time Greats, etc.........never get those labels without championships.
Manning still has time and might pull off an Elway or a Steve Young still, who knows. But until that day, he'll fall behind such names as Brad Johnson, Trent Dilpher, Mark Rypien, Joe Theisman, Phil Simms, Jim Plunkett, Len Dawson, et al...............as a guy with less rings then these household names. Without a ring, he'll be right up there with Fran Tarkenton, Danny White, Warren Moon, Steve Bartkowsky, Joe Kapp, Ron Jawarsky, et al.............as a guy who was darn good, love to have him on my team, and could've had it all but came up short.
Don't forget ending up on the list with his dad Archie Manning. In Archie's defense, he was always on a crappy team.

lewpac
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: Kamuela, HI

#21 Post by lewpac » Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:55 pm

Warrior, there's two schools of thought to that point. Your logic, which is probably more true than not in Archie Manning's case, that of a poor soul with talent never having a team around him.
The other school of thought, and it's used correctly alot of times too, is that a real QB leader/feild general raise's the talent around him and gives the team something to build around.
For instance, Brett Farve. The Packers were mediocre at best for a long time untill Farve arrived. Many believe that HE did more for the program's success than the GM and Head Coach ever did, and I agree. The Eagles blossomed again after McNabb arrived and brought his game with him. Namath and the Jet's, Kelly and the Bills, Bernie Kosar and the Browns, Boomer Esiason and the Bengals, etc........
The argument can be made. Each of these guys had different owners, coaches, GM's, cities, etc.........and it could be argued that one guy's leadership and talent made everyone around him better. It's one of the things teams look for at the combine and during the draft in a QB. It's an intangible that they'll never know until his career unfolds.
Archie Manning was ALL-World comming out of college. It seems to me that all those years with one team, any team, and not only never making the playoffs, but never having a winning season? If he was all that, his presence and leadership would've rubbed off for at least a couple winning seasons.

User avatar
BKWarrior
Hall of famer
Hall of famer
Posts: 2555
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 3:26 pm
Location: Brooklyn,NY (but now at UW-Madison)

#22 Post by BKWarrior » Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:31 pm

Don't know how related this is, but we live in a society now where we are always looking for the next big thing. We rush to find the new brittany spears (ugly) or Beyoncee.
Same with sports, we seem to be pushing for the next Montana or Favre or LT. They used to some to us naturally, and many legends weren't hyped as much as many bad players are today. monatana was not a stud QB when he came out of ND. Guys like Dickerson, and Payton, didn't come from big schools. We just need to be patient (sp?), and let people finish their careers before we give them "legendary" status. We can say, they may be great, but don't say, this guy is great, when he's not done with his career yet.
besides, I think money has gotten too great to give us the legends like we had before.
Forza Italia, campioni del mondo!

botokuno
Pom pom fluffer
Pom pom fluffer
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2006 2:11 am

#23 Post by botokuno » Mon Jan 16, 2006 6:55 pm

lou909 wrote:damn... i didn't know peyton's boyfriend posted here..... :-({|=
That's real mature. I don't know if you could've damaged your credibility any further with that stupid little assinine comment. I'll bet you didn't even bother to read my comment before you posted that. All you did was recognize someone rebuffing you and figured they don't know dick since they obviously don't take the same avenue of thought as you do. Grow up some son.
lewpac wrote:He comes across a little arrogant at the line of scrimage with that whole field general act, all that pointing and yelling and staring down the defense.
I know you'll never truly listen to my arguments since I'm nothing more than "peyton's boyfriend" but how does calling each play at the line of scrimage by identifying players and making sure they are addressed in terms of protection as well as picking the right play in terms of assumed coverage. Johnny Unitas, Otto Grahm and countless other quarterbacks did the same thing in the generation before helmet radiosets. It would be difficult to consider them as arrogant. And besides, didn't Jim Kelly do something similiar when he ran the no-huddle offense during the height of his carreer? Carson Palmer was doing the same thing by mid-season. Plus, in Jon Gruden's system, he gives the quarterback something like three plays and it's up to the QB to make the choice at the line of scrimage.
lewpac wrote:The other school of thought, and it's used correctly alot of times too, is that a real QB leader/feild general raise's the talent around him and gives the team something to build around.
I know this thought, and I think there might be something to it where a true leader can get 110% out of his teammates. But on the same token, I think it carries more weight in a sport where said athelete is plays on both offense and defense (such as basketball). While there are examples of Donovan McNabb playing on what ended up being a broken ankle, which I'm sure inspired his team on both offense and defense, that's an extreme example. I wouldn't want someone to break Peyton's ankle just to inspire the defense. And on the same note, I'm pretty sure after listening to the post-game interviews the defense knew it was as much on them as it was on the slow start to the offense. So what does that mean? It means that Peyton doesn't need to be the type of fiery leader that yells and screams on the sidelines to get the team motivated. Why not? Because it's not the type of team the Colts are under Head Coach Tony Dungy. On Dungy led teams, the atmosphere is more of let's win as a team and not let the other two sides down (offense, defense, and special teams being the three sides). So really, they're more of a self-motivating team than anything else.

lewpac
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: Kamuela, HI

#24 Post by lewpac » Mon Jan 16, 2006 7:31 pm

Botokuno, I think you need to take this forum much more seriously. I don't think you care enough about Manning, and I suggest you move in with him to be a better advocate for him.

lewpac
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Dec 23, 2003 8:01 pm
Location: Kamuela, HI

#25 Post by lewpac » Mon Jan 16, 2006 7:44 pm

Also, you listed Johnny U., Otto Graham, Jim Kelly and Gruden in you defense of Manning. You make our point, with no added maturity required.
Unitas, Graham and Gruden all won championships. Kelly went to four more Super Bowls than Manning currently has been to, all IN A ROW!! Say whatever you want about Kelly, but I was in camp with the USFL Houston Gamblers when he was there. I amounted to nothing more than a blocking bag in camp. But that guy had leader written all over him. You look up "boss-man" in the dictionary and there's a bio of this guy. Please do not use "Jim Kelly" and "Peyton Manning" in the same sentence just yet, it's a little embarassing on your part. Jim Kelly, Thurman Thomas and Marv Levy were the biggest reason the hard-luck Bills were in position FOUR CONSECUTIVE years to win a ring. Their defense was servicable at best all those years.
With that coach, that running back, and those recievers, Manning as of now can be best described as an underachiever, an also ran. Didn't take advantage of all his tools. Especially this year with that defense. He may pull and Elway, who knows. But today, tonight, call it like it is. You know, just like the NFL is this 16th day of January, 2006. And as of this day, your love affair aside, the Colts will go down as one of the biggest egg-layers in recent memory.

User avatar
lou909
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:24 pm
Location: KALIHI.....OAHU

#26 Post by lou909 » Mon Jan 16, 2006 7:53 pm

hahahaha.... yeah really boto boy... you need a chill pill.... first of all..... i did read your post that is why i thought your were peyton's boyfriend because my comments seemed to have triggered a nerve..... second with you comparing what peyton did to leinart in the ND game is like comparing apples to oranges.... leinart's situation was in the final minute of ball game and his audible at the line is something that he is coached to do.... as a QB you are coached to read defenses and....when you see a mismatch or if the defense is in a fomation not to your liking you are coached to audible out.... you don't do it because you feel like it or your being agressive... it's all within your responsibility as the QB......and like I said the leinart play, both of them.... were plays that were made in the closing seconds... not the third quarter.....in fact it was both carroll and leinart that said they both wanted to go for it because carroll did not want to go to OT... your telling me to get the facts right.. brah you need to get the facts right... stupid fuk... see in dungy's case he initially wanted to go with a punt but since your boyfriend wanted to show how cocky he was by waving off the punt team.. dungy had no choice at that time but to go for it because your boyfriend had already showed him up.... think about it you dumbass.....look i know your disappointed that your boyfriend and you may never enjoy a super bowl win but no need to take everything so serious... geeez you act like it's a crime to say something bad about peyton.... it's not my fault he sucks @ss in the playoffs... don't take it out on me take it out on polomalu or maybe joey porter or maybe dick lebeau or maybe bill cowher but not me... i'm not here to make enemies but if you want to be my enemy then...... FAK U..... BIATCH

User avatar
Macnut
Hall of famer
Hall of famer
Posts: 2568
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:15 pm

Re: PEYTON MANNING

#27 Post by Macnut » Mon Jan 16, 2006 9:37 pm

Pomai44 wrote:
lou909 wrote:......... MY BRONCOS WILL WHUP THE STEELERS..... ALL OF YOU CAN JUMP ON THE BANDWAGON... THERE's LOTS OF ROOM.... IN THE TRUNK!!!!!!!! =;
Your make'in a joke right???? There is no way that Denver can beat the Steelers, [-X they aren't even on the same level Denver is two steps lower. Plummer is going to be sacked so many times he won't see the light of day. If anyone thought that Polamalu had a good game yesterday you haven't seen anything yet. He will be flying in Denver.

Even though Hawaii is home, I was born in Pittsburgh, I think they do something in the hospital when your born that makes you a diehard steelers fan. :lol: [/code]
Denver should win. The Broncos are 9-0 this year at home and they are finding ways to win. This will be Pitts 3rd road game and this one will be at high altitude. That tells me that Pitts will not play their usual stellar selves. If that game was played at Pitts, I would pick Pitts.
No matter what, be happy you still got your health!

User avatar
Pomai44
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 335
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:13 am

Re: PEYTON MANNING

#28 Post by Pomai44 » Tue Jan 17, 2006 3:04 am

stick it right up your CANDY @SS!!!!.......
Now see dats why Denver will lose, git a litto pressure en they lose it!!!!

User avatar
Pomai44
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 335
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:13 am

Re: PEYTON MANNING

#29 Post by Pomai44 » Sun Jan 22, 2006 2:30 pm

lou909 wrote:
ohhhh... you better damn well hope that your steelers win cause if they don't.... you better be ready to hear (more like read) it from me..... and when they (steelers) do lose.... you can take your terrible towel turn it sidewayz and stick it right up your CANDY @SS!!!!.......

They never had a chance from the git go. Pittsburgh didn't even blitz that much, Bye Denver Hello Superbowl. Just like Bradshaw said they will beat either of the two doesn't matter which the Seagulls or the Kitty cats.

User avatar
lou909
First guy off the bench
First guy off the bench
Posts: 460
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:24 pm
Location: KALIHI.....OAHU

Re: PEYTON MANNING

#30 Post by lou909 » Sun Jan 22, 2006 4:16 pm

Pomai44 wrote:
lou909 wrote:
ohhhh... you better damn well hope that your steelers win cause if they don't.... you better be ready to hear (more like read) it from me..... and when they (steelers) do lose.... you can take your terrible towel turn it sidewayz and stick it right up your CANDY @SS!!!!.......

They never had a chance from the git go. Pittsburgh didn't even blitz that much, Bye Denver Hello Superbowl. Just like Bradshaw said they will beat either of the two doesn't matter which the Seagulls or the Kitty cats.
congrats..... the steelers deserve to go to Detroit.... they just outplayed my broncos :x ... oh well there's always next year :D .... hope the steelers can win the title... so at least we can say we lost to the SB champs... good luck to your steelers pomai......

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot], MSN [Bot] and 67 guests