amela wrote:I like that y'all have a positive attitude. And why are you saying they should develop high school players? What do they do sit around if they're not starting? Most JC players should be more play ready then high school seniors.
What? All the best programs in the country develop high school talent and stay away from JC kids. That's why a 3-year rebuilding phase is expected of new regimes. So they can develop that talent, and then succeed when the 4-year system is in place with "their" kids.
JC kids had to go that route for a reason. They either weren't good enough out of high school to play FBS ball, or struggled grades wise.
A program built on JC kids is a losing program. There isn't a single FBS program succeeding at a high level while feeding off of JCs.
That's not to say JC players are bad, but hoarding them is not a winning system. It's a band aid.
amela wrote:I like that y'all have a positive attitude. And why are you saying they should develop high school players? What do they do sit around if they're not starting? Most JC players should be more play ready then high school seniors.
What? All the best programs in the country develop high school talent and stay away from JC kids. That's why a 3-year rebuilding phase is expected of new regimes. So they can develop that talent, and then succeed when the 4-year system is in place with "their" kids.
JC kids had to go that route for a reason. They either weren't good enough out of high school to play FBS ball, or struggled grades wise.
A program built on JC kids is a losing program. There isn't a single FBS program succeeding at a high level while feeding off of JCs.
That's not to say JC players are bad, but hoarding them is not a winning system. It's a band aid.
UH is not one of the best programs in the country.
My3Cats wrote:
UH is not one of the best programs in the country.
Definitely not attempting to suggest that, only that if UH wants to at least emulate those programs, it's best to lay a foundation of development.
JC players are meant to fill voids and nothing else. Say the secondary is set, but you need to add a 7th CB to ensure depth....that's where a JC player is acceptable. But I'll take a developed high school talent whose been in the system for years over most JC players.
My3Cats wrote:
UH is not one of the best programs in the country.
Definitely not attempting to suggest that, only that if UH wants to at least emulate those programs, it's best to lay a foundation of development.
JC players are meant to fill voids and nothing else. Say the secondary is set, but you need to add a 7th CB to ensure depth....that's where a JC player is acceptable. But I'll take a developed high school talent whose been in the system for years over most JC players.
I think that's where Chow made one of his first mistakes. He relied more on HS recruits his first couple of years and less on JCs. He should have gone a little more JC then incorporate more HS players. I would definitely like more HS players than JCs but when you're trying to get your type of guys in a program, need to unfortunately rely heavily on JCs at least for the first year.
amela wrote:I like that y'all have a positive attitude. And why are you saying they should develop high school players? What do they do sit around if they're not starting? Most JC players should be more play ready then high school seniors.
What? All the best programs in the country develop high school talent and stay away from JC kids. That's why a 3-year rebuilding phase is expected of new regimes. So they can develop that talent, and then succeed when the 4-year system is in place with "their" kids.
JC kids had to go that route for a reason. They either weren't good enough out of high school to play FBS ball, or struggled grades wise.
A program built on JC kids is a losing program. There isn't a single FBS program succeeding at a high level while feeding off of JCs.
That's not to say JC players are bad, but hoarding them is not a winning system. It's a band aid.
Hate to disagree with you, but I believe that Kansas State and it's head coach Bill Snyder built his program around JC players. Kind of hard to argue with his success. So it can be done.
amela wrote:I like that y'all have a positive attitude. And why are you saying they should develop high school players? What do they do sit around if they're not starting? Most JC players should be more play ready then high school seniors.
What? All the best programs in the country develop high school talent and stay away from JC kids. That's why a 3-year rebuilding phase is expected of new regimes. So they can develop that talent, and then succeed when the 4-year system is in place with "their" kids.
JC kids had to go that route for a reason. They either weren't good enough out of high school to play FBS ball, or struggled grades wise.
A program built on JC kids is a losing program. There isn't a single FBS program succeeding at a high level while feeding off of JCs.
That's not to say JC players are bad, but hoarding them is not a winning system. It's a band aid.
Hate to disagree with you, but I believe that Kansas State and it's head coach Bill Snyder built his program around JC players. Kind of hard to argue with his success. So it can be done.
GO WARRIORS!!
+ Many key contributors on ranked teams are often JC guys. There are tons of players who have major talent, but no grades and are forced into the JC route. Cam Newton ring a bell?
Also, coaches can develop players and in this instance have 3 years. UH has always had major recruiting issues and like a person with a limited budget, you may want the organic steak; however, you can only afford Spam. Enjoy the Spam.
Be humble and confident in yourself and all things you do.
shokee wrote:
Hate to disagree with you, but I believe that Kansas State and it's head coach Bill Snyder built his program around JC players. Kind of hard to argue with his success. So it can be done.
GO WARRIORS!!
That is correct, forgot about KSU and Snyder. They're the exception though, not the rule, and even their success is just on a moderate level. Just because 1 P5 program gets it done to an extent doesn't mean it's a proven success.
Most programs (typically G5) that go all out with JC players tend to face long rebuilding periods after doing so. I have no problem with the elite JC players of the world, but UH isn't landing Cam Newton. Not all JC talents are the same.
shokee wrote:
Hate to disagree with you, but I believe that Kansas State and it's head coach Bill Snyder built his program around JC players. Kind of hard to argue with his success. So it can be done.
GO WARRIORS!!
That is correct, forgot about KSU and Snyder. They're the exception though, not the rule, and even their success is just on a moderate level. Just because 1 P5 program gets it done to an extent doesn't mean it's a proven success.
Most programs (typically G5) that go all out with JC players tend to face long rebuilding periods after doing so. I have no problem with the elite JC players of the world, but UH isn't landing Cam Newton. Not all JC talents are the same.
I don't think Hawaii's got any other choice but to do it the KSU way... at least for the time being. School needs to clean itself up and the football program needs to up the ante in coaching salaries, stadium, and more. Until then, a mix of 3:2 ratio of High schoolers to Juco transfers each year is about right. It's also cheaper when recruiters make mistakes, as it costs UH 1, 2, possibly even 3 years less per Juco transfer.
shokee wrote:
Hate to disagree with you, but I believe that Kansas State and it's head coach Bill Snyder built his program around JC players. Kind of hard to argue with his success. So it can be done.
GO WARRIORS!!
That is correct, forgot about KSU and Snyder. They're the exception though, not the rule, and even their success is just on a moderate level. Just because 1 P5 program gets it done to an extent doesn't mean it's a proven success.
Most programs (typically G5) that go all out with JC players tend to face long rebuilding periods after doing so. I have no problem with the elite JC players of the world, but UH isn't landing Cam Newton. Not all JC talents are the same.
UH has limited choices and the reality is until winning picks up that's the status quo. Even if UH wins a bunch, top talent will opt for P5 schools.
Even in the JJ era, we never landed 4-5 star guys straight from HS and the top local talent. As stated before, UH can be succesful with a scheme that's unique (RNS or Triple option). They can't line up and run the ball down any respectable team throat because of talent gaps or the Pro set a la Mr Chow.
Be humble and confident in yourself and all things you do.
“WELCOME HOME COACH”
Go get’em Timmy 
