Finally! I have found a voice of reason and support for the sport! Why do you have to change my thinking? You don't have to do anything really, but if you support the sport of judo and want to preserve the sport and see it grow, then do all you can to convince those that oppose the rule changes to stay in the sport. I come from the wrestling side, but I love judo too and have grown to love it through my son, who only started for the first time in 7th grade. And if he's on the bubble about joining this season, I am looking for some support from the judo community who supports the rule changes so that I can convince him to stick with it. And what I have primarily read from others, or how I am interpreting it is, "It is what it is... not going have wrestlers coming out now," "You want to wrestle, then stay in wrestling," "No matter anyway, I beat all the wrestlers!" Yes, I should not have "grouped" you with the others, but bestofthebest rubbed almost everyone the wrong way with his punk comments... lot of emotion generated by that 8-year-old.

[quote="h4444k"][quote="donkeykong"]
Why do I have to change your thinking? You are free to have your own opinion about the rules. If you believe it makes no sense to stay in the sport because of the new rules then that is entirely up to you. I get what you are trying to say about the sports evolution but look, leg attacks are only a small portion of what judo has to offer. [b]I don't think players should be leaving the sport for that sole reason when there is lots to learn despite the rule change[/b]. And in addition, I believe (correct me if I'm wrong) that you can still attack legs off of a counter or combination. Funny how you get so upset when I say people whine and stereotype me as a true "judo" person yet it's perfectly fine for you to swear, say we throw "hissy fits", and say I have a defensive, arrogant attitude because I asked you a question. And who said that [i]that[/i] poster is the "true judo ambassador"? I don't agree with the way he put things. And I don't think you should put us all in the same boat.

For the record, I hope your son sticks with judo and does well this upcoming season.[/quote]

Finally! I have found a voice of reason and support for the sport! Why do you have to change my thinking? You don't have to do anything really, but if you support the sport of judo and want to preserve the sport and see it grow, then do all you can to convince those that oppose the rule changes to stay in the sport. I come from the wrestling side, but I love judo too and have grown to love it through my son, who only started for the first time in 7th grade. And if he's on the bubble about joining this season, I am looking for some support from the judo community who supports the rule changes so that I can convince him to stick with it. And what I have primarily read from others, or how I am interpreting it is, "It is what it is... not going have wrestlers coming out now," "You want to wrestle, then stay in wrestling," "No matter anyway, I beat all the wrestlers!" Yes, I should not have "grouped" you with the others, but bestofthebest rubbed almost everyone the wrong way with his punk comments... lot of emotion generated by that 8-year-old.[/quote]


Here's some support for judo, whatever the throwing/takedown rules are:

1. Participation. To me, absent unreasonable danger, might as well participate if the sport is available. During the spring, there's also track (which appears to take all comers), boy's volleyball (needed to specialize long ago), baseball (same - had to specialize long ago), and. . . . I dunno. . . . but it seems to me that judo is a take all comers sport, and that participation is good.

2. I think it's the only contact sport available during the spring.

3. Lifelong participation. Judo is one of those sports that lends itself to being a lifelong activity. Also, even a little exposure during one's youth might give your son a basis to participate confidently with his own son or daughter down the road.

4. Still enhances wrestling. If your kid is a wrestler, it's at the very least more mat time, and, all is not lost. As I understand it, they haven't banned mat work. So, there's still opportunity to use and enhance mat skills. Becoming oriented to the throwing aspects of judo can't hurt a wrestler in terms of extra weapons in the arsenal.

5. Problems with jiu jitsu and MMA as alternatives. Bottom line, jiu jitsu is still emphasizing putting enough pressure on body joints to compel submission. To me, that's not good unless a big part of your son's life is gonna be fighting on the streets. When joints pop, they become permanent injuries. To the extent one practices doing that, and has others practice upon you doing that, regularly, there is more chance you will pop a joint and become permanently injured. With MMA, one of the goals is to knock your opponent unconscious with blows to the head, or inflict crippling pain with blows to the body - as well as pop joints. It's worse than jiu jitsu. Plus, if you really want to physically demean, HUMILIATE, and dominate and show who's best of the best - totally pummel your opponent - all you need is judo with a little wrestling sprinkled in (should your opponent dare to bust a wrestling move on you). See brandonmaki's post above. . . . .of course, not saying that your son would automatically do that kind of stuff. . . . . but if he were so inclined to humiliate and demean and dominate. . .well. . . that's definitely an option. . .

6. The alternatives are: video games, drugs, skateboarding, track and nothing (and any combination of the foregoing).

As a former wrestler, and as the parent of a wrestler/judoka, I highly value that wrestling and judo are civilized, honorable forms of fighting.

I know most of you are Punahou supporters, it's pretty obvious. I understand your frustration because a lot of Punahou judokas use leg attacks but, you have to get used to it. There is nothing you or I can do about this. Maybe it's a blessing in disguise so that the wrestlers can perfect more traditional throws to be more well rounded. Doc Chow is an unbelievable coach and he figured out how to win on a consistent basis using a lot of leg attacks and some traditional judo. I'm sure he will make the adjustment to the Punahou program just fine. I wasn't trying to say that I like to humiliate people like how Bungahead had suggested. I was trying to change your attitudes towards the rule changes. I was saying that with a competitive mindset you can overcome anything especially rules. I was saying that I didn't mind matching anyone technique for technique, or sport for sport. I was just very competitive. I was trying to suggest that maybe to overcome this deficit, embracing it and moving on is the way to go. Instead of complaining and crying over spilled milk.

I was trying to let you see what kind of frustration a judoka faces when their legs are attacked. That's why I said putting on a gi in folk wrestling would be something of equal because I know a lot of you have limited experience in judo. So, I was trying to refer to something that wrestlers would understand. Leg attacks changed the whole dynamics of judo and so would a gi in wrestling. I'm almost certain wrestlers would be against this. I was a wrestler too, and I would be against this. But, anyways good luck to you Punahou even though you are my number one rival. I enjoyed our two conflicting styles of teaching it always made exciting matches. Even without leg attacks I know you'll be there in the end. I'm counting on it. I'll be looking forward to seeing you at states.

all the trash talk u guys do is crazy, you're behind a computer hello, and plus most of you never even did judo so why do you guys even talk nonsense... JUDO IS NOT A SPORT, ITS A WAY OF LIFE... and only those that been in judo as long as i have can understand this sooo....... check this out, the shobukan tournement is comin up in april, there is a division to compete for the grandmaster of the tournement its open weight and open age, i would love to see you guys come out and compete, judo guys, wrestlers, or whatever you guys are... i'll be entering, i'll show u all some old school judo...

and furthermore, i'd like to ask a question, how long has everyone in here actually TOOK AND COMPETED in judo... i would predict brandonmaki and donkeykong did it majority of there lives, (am i right?) i mean its easy to tell, SIMPLE THEY KNOW WAT THEY'RE TALKIN ABOUT, as for PUNDAD, i'm not sure how long hes been in judo, but he seems like he knowS a lot about it too... the only thing i wonder about is that his opinion is one sided, he doesnt like the rule change because hes a punahou dad, and they like to shoot legs over there at punahou... SO HOW LONG HAS EVERYONE IN HERE BEEN IN JUDO, AND WHO CAN HONESTLY SAY THEY COMPETED AT A LEVEL ABOVE HIGH SCHOOL JUDO?

and also how many of you started in JUDO b4 you wrestled?

[quote="bestofthebest"] ... JUDO IS NOT A SPORT, ITS A WAY OF LIFE... .[/quote]


. . . . so. . . .if one does judo their whole life, they come out like you???

[quote="bestofthebest"] ....... check this out, the shobukan tournement is comin up in april, there is a division to compete for the grandmaster of the tournement its open weight and open age, i would love to see you guys come out and compete, judo guys, wrestlers, or whatever you guys are... i'll be entering, i'll show u all some old school judo...[/quote]

I remember as a kid, there used to be a lot judo movies from Japan being played at the old Toyo and Nippon theaters. . . . the judo guy was always fighting the evil jiu jitsu guy. . . I remember one thing in particular from all those old school judo movies. . . all the judo guys seemed to wear those wooden slippers with two slats of wood perpendicular to the foot and ground as the sole of each slipper, so that when they stepped with each foot, it had the effect of walking from one slat to the other. . . . . like these: http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt ... CCEQ9QEwBQ

. . . Are you gonna be wearing those kind of slippers????

I just did some brief research, which makes me cackle with laughter at "bestofthebest's" remarks as the Ambassador of Judo. . . .

I didn't know this, but Kodokan. . . .this organization that MIGHT have some claim to being the arbiter of what is and isn't judo. . . . lists the 67 official Judo throws.

Most germaine to this conversation are the Shinmeisho No Waza. . . which Kodokan still apparently recognizes as "official" judo throwing techniques. . . apparently regardless of what the IJF says about what's going to be allowed in international competition. . . . .

Some of the Shinmeisho No Waza - 8 to be exact were originally developed by Sensei Kano, but for some reason, discarded when Kodokan came out with its initial 40 throws of Judo.

Nonetheless, all except two of the Shinmeisho No Waza have been "official" in the eyes of Kodokan since 1982. . .

http://www.kodokan.org/index.html

Amazingly, to me anyway, the ippon-seoi-nage wasn't added as an official throw until 1997: (scroll down page and look at symbol legend) http://www.kodokan.org/e_waza/index.html
Traditionalists and Old Schoolers: Should the ippon seoinage be illegal and subject to disqualification???? Ambassador?

Here's a list of the 67 official throws with links to video graphic demonstrations: http://judoinfo.com/gokyo.htm


. . . .My basic question is whether these IJF changes are political machinations of competitive organizations, or true to the foundations of Judo. It's one thing to say that the International entities that govern international judo competitions have made politically or economically motivated changes to game rules a la the NFL, or NCAA, or NBA. . . . but I don't see any indication that the holders of the "judo" flame are making similar changes to the the official 67 throws, . . . . .

Of course, perhaps they are waiting until their Ambassador/Emporer "bestofthebest" gets back from stomping everyone at this weekend's Shobukan tournament. . . .then they'll update their website. . . .

. . . .Another thing I read in passing during my research is that Judo traditionally had no weight classes in competitions (the thinking being that weight should not matter) . . . . and didn't permit children to participate, the thinking being that children were too undisciplined to safely survive instructional sessions. . . . . . . just imagine what it'd be like if we REALLY went back to traditional judo. . . . wooden slippers," bestofthebest" having to fight a jiu jitsu guy every day (and at least twice, including the "conclusive" battle, in the rain. . . .in middle of a bamboo grove. . . .), no hs judo, Jordan Ng v. Sani Fuimaono for the State Championship (. . .after they turn 18, of course). . . .

[quote="bestofthebest"]FIRST of all. idiots that dont know a damn thing about judo and its rules, shouldnt even be commenting in here... plain and simple... rules change for a reason, the reason it needed to be changed is simple, if you wanna grab legs join wrestling... it dont really make a difference for me tho, i never been thrown by a wrestler and never will, but thats the reason judo needed to be changed..[/quote


I am scared for the bretheren of Kodokan . . . . when "bestofthebest" gets back from the Shobukan tourney, there's gonna be hell to pay. . . . . good thing Judo doesn't use knives or swords. . . otherwise. . . . brah, . . . .mass hara kiri. . . . but at the very least, it's gonna be like this, only using judo. . . old school judo. . .http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbhY3c9nH6o

Bungahead you're stupid. All that mumble jumble and sarcasm and still you couldn't manage a way to answer bestofthebest's question. How much experience do you really have? Maybe, because you really don't know shit. You can't research something like judo and say you know it. I can tell you don't even pay attention to what the posts are saying because you just want to have diarrhea of the mouth or the fingers in this case. If you were paying attention the Shobukan tournament is not this weekend computer gladiator, it's in April. Time to stop hiding and compete and see what types of book techniques you learned.

[quote="turbo101"]Bungahead you're stupid. All that mumble jumble and sarcasm and still you couldn't manage a way to answer bestofthebest's question. How much experience do you really have? Maybe, because you really don't know shit. You can't research something like judo and say you know it. I can tell you don't even pay attention to what the posts are saying because you just want to have diarrhea of the mouth or the fingers in this case. If you were paying attention the Shobukan tournament is not this weekend computer gladiator, it's in April. Time to stop hiding and compete and see what types of book techniques you learned.[/quote]

eh. . . thanks for the clarification about the Shobukan tourney. . . relieved to know the Kodokan folks have some time before ARMAGEDDON!!!

. . . . and, what in the world are you getting so bent out of shape about???? I'm BACKING UP "bestofthebest", supporting his Ambassadorship, supporting his Emporerness, acknowledging that he's probably gonna open up a BIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIG can of pummel cola on the serfs who dare to challenge him at the Shobukan tourney, and sending out the warning: Kodokan BEWARE! The MASTER IS COMING HOME!!!! Better change that website, QUICK!

Why does it matter what I know??? Any man who asks such a question to the world must know himself that he is INVINCIBLE! Assume I know less than "bestofthebest" becau. . . . wait, need I even say that??? Look, the Ambassador of Judo job must require a high, if not the highest degree of skill and accomplishment. . . . at least enough to beat up anyone on this board who might dare to show their face at the Shobukan Tourney. . . which is. . . in APRIL, right?

Anyway, hope you now see that it is unnecessary to answer your liege Lord's question. . . . what's the use? Any answer establishes ONLY inferiority. . . .

p.s. What's REALLY stupid is to register, log in as "bestofthebest", and then get yourself in such a deep hole after 5 (FIVE!) posts that you have to create the sockpuppet "turbo101". . . not s'posed to do dat. . . . . but FIVE posts???? That's all you can last?? FIVE POSTS?????!?!?!?!?!

Who said he was the ambassador of judo? Again, pay attention dumbass he didn't say that. What's even more stupid is a wannabe bookworm judoka like yourself having nothing better to do than talk poop on a forum. Either get a life or step on the mat book expert.